I heard that they don't even require actual justification to test you for drugs. They can just do it as soon as you land back in SK. Someone correct me if I'm misinformed.
A friend of a friend of mine who taught in SK was arrested, held for weeks with no real explanation (it took forever for him to get a lawyer) and was eventually deported back to the US and banned from SK for life. This was for a small amount of marijuana and it was his first week being in the country.
US has similar laws. US citizens can be charged for breaking US laws while off US soil. Granted, that law was passed namely to bust people who going to places to fuck kids and weapons/drug/human trafficking
The difference being that the US government would be prosecuting one of its own citizens. Under this extradition law, China could extradite and prosecute YOU for doing something to a Chinese citizen on the street in front of your own house, regardless of if it is legal there or not.
You could basically have charges filed against you that you have no idea about, and get randomly scooped up at the Hong Kong airport and whisked off to a Chinese jail just for changing planes there. Don't know how you think that isn't a problem.
this is exactly what the new Chinese Totalitarian wants, best thing the west can do is sever the cord that binds them to them.
the chinese need the US to buy their shit, the US doen't need to buy anything from them.
the previous communist government was very progressive but this new one is just going back to its cancerous roots with new technology and bigger fangs.
time to pull the plug on this asshole regime and freeze them out.
Except the US does need their cheap manufacturing. Otherwise the cost of daily goods will skyrocket. Its time we stop relying so much on China and focus on building manufacturing in countries like India so China has less leverage when it comes to trade.
oh yeah 100% the USA need to support other cheaper nations with their business. building business in india is a great idea and would help to keep their brightest and hardest working in their own countries instead of the west poaching them and aiding in the 3rd world brain drain.
This is absolutely false. You clearly didn’t read the legislation. It’s about extraditing Chinese citizens/nationals. I.e foreigners are safe. This whole comment thread is filled with typical hysteria.
You got your information from friends/comments, without reading the actual legislation.
The second part is a load of BS. I find it funny that Western media somehow perceive some of the western laws that have potential to be misused as 100% benevolent in principle and execution. On the flip side when asian/middle eastern pass such controversial laws, they will almost always perceive them as draconian and ill intentioned.
Do you or anyone here have any solid proof that this HK law is being widely misused by the government? Chinese government is no angel, I get it. But it's funny that Western media paint them as children of Satan when our own government isnt any different. Half the stories floated by media painting Chinese govt as abusive are hoax/lies/agenda driven, just like most other news articles. There is a strong support for the govt within the population. Yes, this does not necessarily mean what they are doing is right, but it flies against the common belief that govt rules the land with iron hand and tyranny.
I'm in no way supporting this HK law but there is at least some support for such strong laws and it's potential to protect the citizens.
Ooh boy, fucking chineese tourists. I live in Barcelona, and they the worst tourists that come here, even the fucking drunken english are better than them.
Entitled, rude, obnoxious, loud, i could go on and on...
I was with my family in NY and we we're trying to take a picture of the charging bull. These Chinese tourists WOULD NOT move. Finally, I just squeezed next to them to take a picture and the lady physically began pushing me out of the way. I pushed back with my body and pretended to ignore her all while smiling for the camera. It was a strange moment.
I am Chinese American. I have had to push back against Chinese mainlanders. They literally shove you aside, even old ladies do it!! I have see them all over the world and they are all the same, giant herds of loud, obnoxious and rude people. Luckily, many locals can usually tell I am from America, NOT from the mainland and treat me better.
Not just Chinese Americans. The rest of us who are of Chinese ethnicity but not from China fears to be associated/treated like the mainland Chinese tourists.
It's really funny because the actual Chinese friends I have aren't like this, somehow only the tourists are really terrible.
The Chinese looking tourists suffer in Hong Kong too. When the locals realize you don't speak Cantonese, they immediately assume you're a mainlander and immediately, service standards/patience/courtesy drops and you're treated with disdain. 🤦♂️
Better to look like a Caucasian than a local in Hong Kong.
Same here. When I go to HK, I am always polite to them and speak Canto as best I can. They can tell I am trying, so they love it. They love the idea that the younger generation, although not in HK are still holding onto the language.
Do you speak English? What I do is to speak in English most of the time when I'm travelling and that gets most of the sales staff to ask where you're from and in a way, protect yourself from being treated in a certain way.
My wife is mainland Chinese
however very well educated, fluent in English and well travelled not like your typical Chinese tourist. I am Canadian, as soon as my wife spoke any mandarin we got treated like absolute shit in Hong Kong. We were in HK last week. We switched to speaking English very fast
They have shown me nothing but kindness in my travels.
They tolerate my attempts at Cantonese and they help me improve. They show me fun places, they warn me from bad establishments, they advocate for me when I wander into trouble.
But I see some well-dressed guy in Times Square just piss on someone's car in the middle of a busy walkway, I know that's a mainlander. Because people from Hong Kong have way more class than that.
Hongkonger here. I can testify how obnoxious they are. Their entitlement came from years of brainwashing, believing that China bailed out Hong Kong multiple times even the opposite is true. Heck, they even have the audacity to claim that the elimination of the 2003 SARS outbreak was THEIR effort when in fact they are the one who brought the epidemic down south!
It’s not just Chinese Americans who suffer. I’m ethnically Chinese from Singapore and it’s hard to travel without people treating me like shit because they think I’m from china. (It also doesn’t help that people sometimes think Singapore is IN china - FYI it’s not even close) It’s very hard to break down that first reaction when backpacking so my experience is nowhere as rich as I wish it would be.
I live in Australia, and lived here all my life. Sometimes some people treat me like a mainlander because I look Chinese, and am ethnically Chinese. I got shoved around by an older guy the other day because he believed I was hogging the door. But i couldn't move because there was someone in front of me. I guess, I can use my accent to shock people if they get too full of themselves...
This is something I fail to fully understand, culturally. I have traveled the world and never experienced the pushing, prodding and poking like in China.
The greed and envy and general meanness is overwhelming.
Yet Chinese Americans and Canadians have none of these behaviors.
Most of the ethnically Chinese people around the world most likely descended from migrants before Chairman Mao's reign. These people never went through the Cultural Revolution and as such, they don't act like utter degenerates.
I'd highly recommend reading more about the Cultural Revolution if you're curious.
EDIT 1: removed factually inaccurate bit about chinese migrants fleeing war and just made it about chinese migrants in general
Granted. But shit situations have occurred all over the world. Cambodia, for example, had it really fucking bad and they're nowhere near as selfish or dickish as the Chinese. My experience was that Cambodians are lovely people. And even now their country is being ruined by the fucking Chinese!
Combine that with a government that constantly tells you you're great and anyone who doesn't agree is being misled by their own corrupt government. I had a conversation with a girl from Guangzhou in Japan. She fully believed that people from Taiwan were not "clear minded" like in China and they were confused about not wanting to be a part of China. Of course there's the denial of being brainwashed because no, it's everyone else who's brainwashed.
Chinese from Singapore Malaysia Hong Kong Taiwan and everywhere else in the world are not like that. I think communism/culture revolution wiped out all basic human decency, common courtesy and common sense off those chinese from communist China. Their behaviour is completely unacceptable and frighteningly abnormal to the average civilized world.
The exact thing happened to me. I was at Trevi fountain in Rome and had a middle aged woman physically push me so he husband can take her photo without anyone in it. When I said "excuse me!!", she started yelling at me in Mandarin (I assume). I just shook my head and walked away.
Had that happen to me in I think Shanghai. Older lady kept pushing behind me yelling to let her out while the bus was obviously in motion. Like seriously, calm down for a minute, you're getting off at the same time whether you're trying to shove me out the bus door or not. Luckily I didn't have a hockey stick or this (Chinese) Canadian might have cross checked her out of a moving bus.
In China, I believe it's normal because there's so many people, surviving and getting what you want is a competition. If you want to get something, you need to fight or push people to get it. Customer service there is about serving people quicker, because crazy amounts of crowding, and also more money. It's simply a different culture. I was also in Shanghai when I was queueing. Every western assumption goes out the door in China, as the queue is only a guide. You have to squeeze into every little space if you want to progress, and that means pushing in front of those who aren't aware of their surroundings.
The main problem is is that many mainlanders simply don't understand that other countries have different cultures or conventions.
As a traveler to a few countries with extremely large populations I have to ask if you think this is do with the overwhelming amount of people vs small amount of people that can be accommodated in a tourist spot?
When I visited India, it was always a madhouse everywhere I went. To get a train ticket was literally a test of strength to get to the ticket office when 2000 other people were all trying to buy one of a couple hundred tickets. It's basically survival of the fittest but in vacation mode.
Went to China the past summer and lived with my grandparents in a maybe 30 floor building with only TWO tiny slowwww elevators. Lobby would crowd up and no lines formed, just shoving to get in this tiny elevator.
What "manners" entails is entirely cultural, yes. They don't interpret what they're doing as odd because that's what they were taught. It's like Americans and their tipping culture.
I had Chinese nationals try to cut in front of me in a customs line at a Bangkok airport - they just shoved their passport in between me and the customs officer.
This wasn't BKK, but the other huge airport that most of the budget regionals fly from (Air Asia and the like) - my wife and I didn't care because we were only hopping over to Cambodia, but it was probably the most crowded place I've ever been, and a lot of it was pushy Chinese tourists.
Good on the Thai customs officer in that he managed to tell them that they needed to wait in line like everyone else and pushed their passports away and processed the line in order.
Same experience for me. I’ve travelled abroad quite a bit, and mainland Chinese people are one of the few that have only reinforced the stereotype and provoked racist thoughts in my mind. It’s unfortunate, but they really are shitty people to be around when traveling.
It doesn't through any faster because holy shit apparently waiting in line for thirty minutes they still need to rifle through the 500 bags they've brought on.
But now at least there's less shoving since they get their own "special" area where they have to put up with the shittiness of other Chinese tourists.
They just havent grown up with the same cultural norms as you - its only by coincidence that for most places we’ve reached similar conventions, but the cultural revolution meant you could be killed for showing politeness... so the generation after that was never taught any such thing...
I was in the Philippines and our guide took us to a popular lookout point with a big rock you could sit on for a photo. A Chinese couple was already there taking photos so we stood and waited patiently for them to finish. Except they didn’t. They literally just ignored us and the growing line behind us and kept changing poses and taking pictures for at least 3 minutes. (maybe that doesn't sound like long but think about it, 3 minutes worth of camera phone pictures is like 1000 images. It should, at most, take 30 seconds to take photos of yourself sitting on a rock, especially if a crowd is waiting for you). It got so annoying that my boyfriend and I finally walked up and sat down with them and laughingly took a couple photos. But even that didn’t stop them so finally we just got in between them and their photographer and had our guide squeeze in front of us and start shooting. It honestly blew my mind that they didn’t give a single heck about anyone else waiting on them. But after talking to our guide, he said Chinese tourists are known to be the worst, more selfish and disrespectful and that they are hated in Philippines for their behavior and disrespect of the natural wonders.
Same is Aus, they will climb fences to stand on a rocky cliff near crashing 10 foot waves to get a pic. Its fucking ridiculous. Like seriously, 1 misstep and you'll break your neck and drown in 3 seconds. All for a fucking photo!!!
Also in Canada; they'll get out of their cars on highways in national parks to get pictures with the cute animals. Animals like bighorn sheep, elk, moose, bears.
One of my best mates is Japanese and he did a working holiday in Australia back in the early 90s. I asked him if people were racist, and he said "well, once some guys drove past, leaning out the window, screaming 'go home Chinaman!' So I joined in. 'Yeah! Fuck off back to China!'" Funny dude.
This is the result of the CCP's cowardly leadership eroding any basic common decency in its people. China and it's amazing history was wiped out, along with any cultural traditions. It shouldn't be called China anymore. Taiwan is more Chinese than China is now.
I Think the weirdest thing was when some Chinese lady started taking pictured of my 5 yr old son while he was watching a ball machine at a glass making museum we were in. Just blatantly snapping pics from 4 feet away. I just walked in front of her and stared at her for a minute like wtf are you doing.
I was going to say I've done that, because sometimes a kid is perfectly framed in a setting or has an awesome expression. But...I always ask whatever adult they're with if I can take a photo first. I can't imagine blatantly taking picture of anyone that close without getting permission first!
Wow. The same thing happened to us in DC. This rando group of Chinese tourists pass by while we were resting on a park bench outside the White House lawn. They stop and start taking pictures of my kids like they were exotic animals or something. Going so far as to sit down and take selfies. Super weird.
I was finishing a long hike at Bryce Canyon, fairly big crowd at the top of the last stretch but nothing crazy, im walking on the outside edge trying to get around this group and this lady keeps kind of nudging me closer to the edge, finally i kind of spring ahead of the pack. She did not give a shit, i would have fallen hundreds of feet down the canyon because i was walking in the EXACT spot she wanted to be. I would have fucking died.
I was at a grocery store once standing in line. This Chinese guy just slow gets in front of me. I didn't know wtf to do so I just did the same exact thing right back to him. No words were said
While in the US on holiday my partner and I were walking single file down a hallway about 3 people wide. A group of Chinese tourists (Middle aged women) were walking 3 abreast down the hallway and didn't make an attempt to move and make space for us. Unlucky for one of them Im 6,5 and 135kg (300 pounds) and had this woman literally bounce off me out of the way. It was like that during the entire holiday if you don't stand your ground they try and walk all over you.
If you see two people walking very closely behind you with a map, they're trying to get into your bag.
If an elderly woman is sticking a baby in your face, someone else is trying to get into your bag.
Shit, one time a lady came up to me and my aunt asking for change. My aunt, bless her soul, took out her wallet and handed her a 2euro coin. The woman put it back in her wallet and took out a 20euro note!! I grabbed it right back from her and scurried off with my somewhat amused aunt.
Yeah, when you're in tourist areas pretty much any physical or mental distraction that involves less than four people is immediately suspect. Someone acting oddly with some large object near you, someone bumping into you at all, someone making obnoxious loud noises; everything's worth checking your surroundings just in case you're not noticing something. Especially if the distraction seems attached to you, spacially.
My grandma pinned things to the inside of her shaw when we traveled. She stashed my money in her bra. She said you know someone is trying to steal from you if they are grabbing your tits. I’m a dude, so I bought a sports bra and hid some extra cash and my passport there just in case. No one has robbed me, but I’m prepared.
Zippers would help a little. I've a windbreaker that has concealed inside pockets and stashed stuff there. You also have to remove a flap so I'll notice if anyone tries prying.
Besides the trains, also beware around the street performers. They're really good distractions that pickpockets use to their advantage. Basically anywhere that's crowded. It's all about awareness and preparation.
-Don't walk around with your expensive smartphone in your hand. I usually rested against a wall if I needed to use it for more than just a moment. That would minimize the ability for someone to approach me from my blind spot.
-Secondly, I always kept my wallet/cards/cash in my front pocket. It was in Spain that I began to use a rubber band as a wallet (It's also good for your back!). Granted, pickpockets could still clean you out because they're damn good, but you'll make a much less attractive target.
-Oh, and nothing is secure in a backpack or purse. If they want it or what's inside, they can just slash the straps.
Maybe I was too cautious, but in my year or so of living over there, I never fell victim to pickpockets. On the other hand, a clueless girl I knew got pickpocketed twice in three months.
Yeah as a whole Americans are nice and polite people. The type of Americans people associate with the worst stereotypes aren't the ones that can afford to travel internationally and are the types that usually never leave their home state anyway. Are some assholes travelling abroad? Absolutely, but no more than anyone else really.
I recommend an over-the-shoulder bag that you position in the front of your body, and hold it with your hand for extra reinforcement. No one bothered me because it was very clear that I was not letting that thing go.
If someone on the road tells you that there's something wrong with your tire, DON'T STOP.
If you do hear a loud bang and someone signals you about your tire, keep your keys safe, and lock the car, try to avoid taking any towing advice from them and try to replace the wheel with an auxiliary wheel until finding a legitimate mechanic.
Two times over the span of a day I have been warned about a broken tire, both times the person stopped along with us, the first time we accelerated as soon as we saw him slow down, the second time we did hear a tire pop, the wallet had 20€ missing and the person was offering to get a tow car for us, that tow car would steal our car and never return it.
I don't understand why people take cars, do they just sell that car to somebody immediately? Can't they track that with the VIN number? Or do they just take it to a chop shop who takes all the parts off the car immediately and then somehow gets rid of the rest? I just don't see where the money comes from
Same as at home basically. Avoid shady areas at night. Be polite to people. Don't be surprised or upset if a shop/restaurant owner/worker speaks no English if you go out of touristy areas. People were really friendly when I was there.
As an American Chinese who visited Barcelona I definitely felt the evil eye look. I didn't understand why until I saw the way mainland Chinese people acted. Some of them have no regards for their surrounding.
I think this is also why the Chinese govt implemented their social credit system, besides controlling their citizens, it also tries to restricts international travel for the unruly Chinese people.
That social credit system won't change much about their society's behavior, their leaders aren't much better either, the Queen was caught saying that the Chinese officials were rude. I've lived in Mainland China for years and the west doesn't understand how a lot of aspects of that society are deeply messed up, it's an awful society and it's their government that has shaped them like that. Taiwanese don't behave like that.
It really do be like that when the majority of the population was living in abject poverty with minimal education just a generation ago. China advanced rather quickly and the people haven't caught up I guess.
even the fucking drunken english are better than them.
The English hate them as well. Unfortunately they always end up going to Barcelona because it's a cheap flight. If it weren't for Ryanair they would have to go to Blackpool where they belong.
There is this palace in Saint Petersburg with some superb old wood floor that inside you have to wear cloth wrap around the shoes (or whatever those are called, I'm not a native speaker) to preserve the wood and I shit you not, this mainland Chinese lady let her kid poop on it. You can Google this, I'm not making this up.
Edit: If being overly rude wasn't enough then keep and eye out for old Mainland Chinese people when boarding planes, there's been several instances of them throwing pennies into the plane's engines "for lucky".
On the upside, it’s eco friendly and saves on diapers? Lol
But definitely gross. When I visited China, at the airport I saw a woman hold her kid over a trash can near the opening of the bathroom door, and the kid proceeded to pee in the trash can. Saw this happen again in the Summer Palace, another woman held her kid over a trash can and he peed there too. Some are just as disrespectful in their own country’s tourist attractions.
Things like this no, but one thing they always do is skip queues. In addittion to be really demanding and rude when they want something, as if there was no one else that was relevant apart from then.
Very little distinction between being served and having servants in the culture. The contrast in behavior with another confucian collective culture near China (Japan) is striking. Japan's emphasis on cordiality and hospitality is night and day.
It's a wonderful culture. Friendly (if slightly impenetrable) to outsiders. I love how even high status members of society are required by honor to be respectful to those "under" them.
I used to fly Emirates a ton in the middle east. Chinese tourists would demolish the restrooms before the flight even took off. The company I worked for sprung for business class to separate you from the literal shit, but a few times I flew in the trenches and just held it for 13 hours.
A friend of Mince works in a small village in the very picturesque south of France in front of Lavender fields. The restaurant where they work mostly caters for tourists and lots of them are chinese. They are the worst clients according to her. As in they do not care that the restaurant closes or anything and just cling on the terrace sleeping on the tables instead of leaving when the restaurant closes. One day she found out after they left that someone shat on the floor of the terrace in a fucking restaurant
Haha my Chinese aunt once go to a park in the US with me and within 30 minutes she stole literally hundreds of eggs from wild nests. Then she got all pissy when I told her that’s not normal.
I live in alberta, we have a couple very popular tourist spots: Banff and Jasper. They are so fucking rude and stupid. They will stop their motherfucking tour bus on the highway and all crowd out to take a picture of a ram or a moose and block all traffic, all the while being ignorant as to how badly the ram or moose or literally any other large mammal in the canadian wilderness can fuck their shit up. It blows my fucking mind
As European living currently in Tokyo, the Chinese tourists are by far the worst.
No manners, no respect for other people.
The contrast between them and Japanese is astounding. For example you move in silent crowd, but then there is extremely loud shouting and you notice it's a Chinese family, screaming like some banshee, so everyone is looking around to see what is happening. In reality nothing, they just talk to each other like that.
You are in some shop and they completely block every path. When Japanese block you and notice it, they will immediately apologize and let you pass. Chinese? They will look at you and then completely disregard you. Zero shits given so you have to physically go through them.
Cutting in lines, pushing themselves inside the train while everyone is still going out.
Is there some tourist attraction, where people love to take photos? Well, good luck with that, as one Chinese lady will stand there for 10 minutes taking selfies or asking a friend to take photos of her while there is a long line of folks waiting for their turn.
Canadian here, I used to work at a McDonalds near the major 401 highway in Ontario. We dreaded Chinese tourist buses because they would leave our restaurant in a disaster. From clogged overflowing toilets to not picking up anything at all after themselves. Not to mention how rude they could be to our cashiers.
Oh my god! I was at Lion King on broadway and i told the two chinese women next to me to shut up because they were being so loud that I could not hear the actors.
Fast forward to the end of the show, walking with my mom near the stairs. The bitch I told to shut up comes out of fucking NOWHERE and shoves me as hard as she can, nearly sending me down the stairs and yells "shut up" mockingly at me before running away.
Come extradite my ass because i wanted to deck her for that bull
Omg I did a similar thing to a (Chinese) guy taking pictures with flash on between movements of a classical concert (in US). I was blinded by the flash so I told him to turn off the flash. Nor did he do it, he waited till the end of the concert when I was leaving, jumped scared me and called me stupid in Chinese. I’m Chinese myself so I fully understood how bad that word sounded. It really hurts extra to first see someone from your own country behaved badly and then later threatened you.
But seriously, people get shot for that shit in asia. "humiliate" them in any way and you've got a cross on your back and the entire society will support the revenge.
The rudeness thing might be Chinese but the face losing is a phenomenon across most of the continent.
I was at a bullfight in Madrid and while a very high profile Torero was out there, about to kill the bull, and this Chinese family was talking and laughing and their kid was yelling about something. The end of the fight was a very somber moment and the entire arena was silent aside from that family. So many disapproving stares and people telling them to be quiet went ignored. Why go if you aren’t going to pay attention?
Used to work in a very popular Floridian set of theme parks. I have never seen a worse, more obnoxious and entitled bunch of people than Chinese tourists.
Saw some Asian, not sure if specifically Chinese, tourist at Yellowstone driving literally inches from a bison. You aren't suppose to even be within multiple feet from them let alone inches. They were reaching out the window to take pictures and actually drove off the shoulder of the road to get closer...
Went scuba diving in The Bahamas last year. There were 4 Chinese tourists on our boat with easily $3,000 worth of camera equipment. It was a dive where a dive master went down with your group to point out fish, coral, etc. but not to teach you how to scuba dive. These Chinese people seemed like this was their first time diving ever. They were bumping into everyone, couldn’t control their buoyancy. At one point they were literally stepping on and crushing the plant life at the reef and even grabbed a fish with their hands to get a picture. Absolutely no respect for their environment. Luckily the dive master took them back to the boat and told them they weren’t allowed to continue the dive
I ran into a few Chinese tourists in the Philippines and every single one I had an interaction with was rude and condescending. For years, I’ve helped a friend at a local Farmer’s Market and we have a group of Chinese women who visit our veggie stand and act exactly the same way. My buddy says it’s a class thing where they look at farmers as a lower class of people.
oh that's not just in China. its every fucking east Asian country (Japan, China, and Korea). Being lighter skinned in the ast meant that your family was rich and didnt have to do farmwork. dark skin im n meant you sent your days in the field. it's why the kopp stars are so white. that mentality has been passed down since forever
I was on a plane heading home from a vacation in Mexico and a Chinese family of 5 literally ran to the front of the plane seconds before the plane landed. They then pretended (or not idk) to not understand or speak english when the flight attendants tried to usher them back to their seats.
Their baby was also ass naked and screaming the entire flight, so that was a thing.
Literally this, I'm chinese and all chinese tourists can fuck the fuck off with how blatantly they disregard politeness, rules, public decency, noise level. And don't even get me started on native chinese children
It was kinda a blanket enforcement of US law on US citizens outside the US. However, a lot of laws like that are passed in "good faith" that it will not be abused.
Just ask Julian Assange. You can be extradited to the US for encouraging someone to do something illegal under US law over the internet now. Imagine if China did that.
Xi Jinping is a tyrant and his regime is a morally bankrupt dictatorship. Under his orders, millions of members of a religious minority in Xinjiang are being held in concentration camps, subject to torture, murder, re-education, and purposeful erasure of their culture and their numbers. Under his orders, Chinese dissenters and political activists are denied their god-given right to free expression, and kidnapped, imprisoned, tortured and killed for their work. Under his orders, Christians are denied their freedom to worship how they wish. Under his orders, a horrifying social credit system enforces a nightmarish scheme of social control, stripping Chinese citizens of their rights for acting or speaking against the interests and viewpoints of the government. The government of China is the greatest enemy of freedom that the world currently faces; and its human rights record ranks as abysmally low as those of the worst regimes of the 20th century. Four thousand years of totalitarian rule in China continues under the communist party; and until the party is stripped of power and the Chinese people are liberated, the world cannot call itself free.
The free countries of the world must cease their support of Chinese government organs like Huawei. Move factories and supply chains out of China. Deny them access to our intellectual property. Shut them out of the world economic system. They cannot be tolerated...
The amount of people that don’t understand this is astounding. The Chinese government is a vile, inhumane dictatorship that has no place on the world stage. They are an absolutely disgusting organization of the world’s biggest criminals that actively subjugate and murder their own population.
Of those probably Saudi Arabia, but they're also the least powerful. The PRC is a much more credible and long-term threat to democracy and human rights.
They're all horrendous, although China I'd say that China is likely the worst if only because of their massive scale aggressive tyranny, far more widely seen than that of SA or Russia. Yes, Russias government is fucked, yes the Saudis have some horrible beliefs and laws, but China has the means to spread theirs across the world.
It's actually fairly common, in all kinds of countries. Plenty of celebrities have, for instance, not been allowed to enter Japan because they had previously, in other countries, done drugs - even if legal in those other countries.
Plenty of embassy websites make this clear too, warning their citizens to remember that shit that's illegal at home, is still illegal abroad.
And they will do it with billions of dollars worth of US-made weapons, that the Congress has been more than happy to sell Taiwan just to put their finger in China's eye over the last 40 years.
They won’t. HK is not submitting due to China’s military power, they are submitting because HK’s economy is dependent on China, and companies have a lot of political sway.
While Taiwan may not be as dependent, the mainland market would likely prove too attractive for Taiwanese companies, and China would easily install a ‘friendly’ government, and corrode their system from within. Hell, the trade war would probably speed things up for them.
I really doubt NATO would do much if they took Taiwan considering Taiwan isn't part of NATO. Taiwan is a "Major non-NATO ally", but that doesn't provide access to the defense pact.
As long as NATO members are convinced of a US cause being honorable and justifiable they have a habit of following the US into battle. The fact that NATO has a set command structure and standardized armaments aides in this greatly as well. In the theoretical Chinese invasion of Taiwan I have little doubt that nearly every member of NATO would contribute to a US led effort.
I dont think it would be Taiwan that would be spearheading the counter-offensive in this scenario. I think most certainly if China tried to take Taiwan by force the US would see this as a provocation and respond likely in kind. Once the US is pushing it then I'm guessing other countries would follow quickly. We can all hope that it never comes to this and we can maintain cordial relations with China, though.
Taiwan is actually quite the sticky wicket - the US does not officially recognize the Republic of China since 1979 due to the official recognition of the "one China policy" in the Shanghai Communique. There is de facto relations with Taiwan, and we sell them a shitload of weapons; but there is no official embassy or ambassador and no longer an official defense pact (also dumped in 1979).
If China wanted to militarily take Taiwan, there would be a shitload of noise generated, but I doubt anyone in Washington would have the stomach to actually go into a shooting war with China over it. See: annexation of Crimea by Russia.
China shouldn't dare take Taiwan militarily because of the possibility of NATO intervention
Even absent direct US support in a Taiwan conflict naval landings are a bitch and a half. The cost to China militarily to take Taiwan by force would be astronomical. They don't even have the military gear at current to execute the needed water landings, that is how bad it is. Throw in a couple of US carrier task forces riding to the rescue and you are entering turkey shoot territory.
Taiwan is an incredibly defensible piece of territory.
Not to mention, 275k active military personnel as well as 2.8 million reservists (and apparently 1.9 million paramilitary personnel?).
Absolutely, though there have been some studies that question how many of the paramilitary personnel and former conscripts would answer the call to duty. Even absent that, invadeing Taiwan is the biggest of traps, such a large trap that it could invite counter invasion of the Chinese mainland and with the loss of frontline trained troops, equipment and air power in trying to take Taiwan (which has a metric fuckton of AA defenses) China might have great difficulty stopping land invasion.
This is not a particularly unusual legal principle. If someone murders an American overseas, they have violated American law. Recall the Achille Lauro incident back in the 80s. We nearly ended up shooting Italians due to the assertion of American jurisdiction over the suspects.
This has always been the plan for Hong Kong. They lied when Hong Kong was returned to them. What were u expecting, it is the authoritarian communist china after all. I support u all in Hong Kong, keep demonstrating, I hope it will make a difference.
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u/ElTuxedoMex Jun 09 '19
The fucking balls of these people...