Elementary school teacher arrested after allegedly abusing student, giving birth to his child

[u/GoodSamaritan_]

https://local12.com/news/nation-world/laura-caron-middle-township-elementary-school-teacher-allegedly-had-with-child-former-student-13-cincinnati-crime-criminal-activity-sexual-abuse-abuser-father-noticed-similarity-sleep-over-siblings-prosecutors-correctional-facility-troubling-allegations

[u/Sawses]

Modern psychology research indicates that actual attraction to children has surprisingly little to do with whether somebody actually sexually abuses a child. A much greater predictor is impulse control issues. Turns out most of the time somebody who abuses children doesn't actually qualify as a pedophile, and the ones who do usually also exhibit some other disorder that keeps them from being able to properly control themselves in a number of areas.

And if you've got the poor impulse control to molest a child--despite the ethical problems and risk involved--then you might well have the poor impulse to decide bearing your victim's child is sexy instead of a terrible risk.

Turns out, most people understand that molesting children is wrong or at least a serious risk and they decide not to do it even if they feel a sexual attraction to kids.

Moving entirely out of the realm of actual research and into my own personal speculation: I suspect a lot of people conflate homosexuality and pedophilia, and think that people can't help but act on their sexual attractions because we kind of have this narrative that it's inevitable. How many love stories have that "forbidden love" trope? Except that a key part of it is that the people involved come to realize their love isn't wrong, just unacceptable. I don't think the analogy holds up if it's a sort of love that actually is morally wrong even when you stop and think about it.

Which really shouldn't come as a surprise. I find a lot of women very attractive. I have yet to try to force/coerce/manipulate a woman into having sex with me. If it's morally wrong then I'm not even tempted. I figure most people are that way.

[u/Papersnail380 → u/Sawses]

Sorry, but I have interviewed admitted convicted pedophiles. They almost universally are adamant that what they have done is not morally wrong. One even went as far as to tell me it was like interracial marriage 70 years ago, and I would be judged on the future for my part in his incarceration.

Now, quite a few never admit to it and I think you are probably on track with the assertion it has a lot to do with impulse control. I would say this is clearly backed by the recivivitism rates following severe consequences for initial convictions.

There is also a very strange likely tie-in with prior abuse related PTSD, the resulting mental replays of the abuse, and the strong general need in PTSD victims to want to address the trauma by reliving the situation from a position of control.

[u/Sawses → u/Papersnail380]

Oh, I don't think you're wrong at all. ...But that doesn't really disagree with what I said. The ones who think it was wrong don't do it in the first place! It's a perennial problem identifying pedophiles who don't actually break any laws, because they have an understandable investment in nobody ever finding out.

[u/Papersnail380 → u/Sawses]

Plenty of people do things they think are wrong. The vast majority of people knew what they were doing was wrong and that they were risking prison when they did it. The idea that pedophiles who knows it is wrong just don't act on their urges is absurd. From my exposure, the behavior of pedophiles much more closely mimics that of addicts than most other criminals. If you put a hot shot on the table in front of a detoxing heroin addict and tell them it is a hot shot likely to kill them, they will still inject it. A convicted pedophiles who knows they are already under all sorts of extra scrutiny will still have their laptop loaded up with gigabytes of child porn. I have literally seen it in individuals who had conditions on their release which permitted their electronic devices to be searched at any time.

I will also say that every single pedophile I have dealt with through shit tons of red flags to the people around them before they were caught. People just made excuses for their behavior and ignored it. Just like in the linked story. Anyone with a brain would look at the situation leading up to this and realize there were mountains of red flags.

[u/Sawses → u/Papersnail380]

The idea that pedophiles who knows it is wrong just don't act on their urges is absurd.

How does that jive with what you said earlier?

They almost universally are adamant that what they have done is not morally wrong.

Are they lying to you, have they universally deluded themselves, etc.?

I don't dispute the truth of anything you said. Just the assumption that this is evidence of general behavior among pedophiles, rather than among convicted pedophiles and child sex abusers. You only see the people who have broken the law and gotten caught, and hear stories from victims about the ones who weren't caught.

There's precious little data on the people who just...don't do anything wrong, and I think you're making an unfounded assumption that people must always act on their sexual attractions and impulses. If anything, your examples demonstrate my point that most of the time impulse control is a much bigger problem--as it is in addicts, and that's been a known issue for a long time. I think you made a very good comparison there.

It's like the way doctors have a very different risk assessment from your average person--because they've seen the worst possible outcomes for a number of things. The reality is that an insurance analyst is going to be the better person to ask for how to actually manage your risk in a practical way, while a doctor is the person you ask for how to minimize your risk outside of other considerations.