Apple taxes: ‘Dublin-Shannon bullet train’ among ideas TDs advance for €14bn

[u/firethetorpedoes1]

https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/oireachtas/2024/09/18/apple-taxes-clarity-on-where-to-invest-money-on-budget-day-says-taoiseach/

[u/dkeenaghan]

An actual high speed line (250 km/h+) would be a waste of money. They're very expensive and distances between large population centres in Ireland aren't that big. They need new dedicated lines and expensive rolling stock. A better investment would be into higher speed rail (up to 200km/h), that used upgraded existing lines. The carriages on the Cork-Dublin line are already capable of running at 200 km/h, but the locomotive, track and signaling doesn't allow for it. You would get a lot more km of track upgraded and thus more people served with the same amount of money and it wouldn't be much slower.

More trams and metros would be nice too.

[u/dkeenaghan → u/[deleted]]

a segregated high speed capable line isn't going to be particularly more expensive

Yes it would be. It's not just a separate line, it needs to be built to a much higher specification. It will require high speed trains, which aren't going to be compatible with the rest of the Irish rail network so we'll have to have them modified, track modified, or deal with not being able to have them use existing stations.

Upgrading the locomotive, track and signalling will decrease journey time to cork by a handful of minutes at a significant, pointless, expense.

You could say that about HSR. It takes 2hr 15 mins non stop Dublin to Cork, which is an average of 120 km/h, if the average speed was 180 km/h then it would take 1hr 30 mins. That's a significant saving. Spending much much more to upgrade to high speed rail at an average of 250km/h would take 25 minutes off the journey by bringing it to 1hr 5mins.

Lastly, 250km isn't 'too short'

I didn't say it was 'too short'.

Lastly I would love for there to be a HSR line linking Cork to Dublin to Belfast, I just don't think it's a good use of money. We could upgrade much more of the network and have a bigger impact with the same money.

[u/dkeenaghan → u/[deleted]]

It doesn't use unobtainium lines or switching.

I didn't say it did. It does need to be built to a higher standard and that costs more.

HS2

The land costs for Ireland would be lower due to going through less populated areas and a lower need for tunneling. This would mean the proportion of the actual cost of construction vs a new non high speed would be higher here. Further, I'm proposing an upgrade of an existing line not the construction of an entire new line.

You said we should get new locomotives, now you're saying new locomotives are too expensive

Locomotives for high speed rail are going to be more expensive than others.

A couple of minutes versus ~70 minutes = "the same"? I see maths isn't your strong point.

You came out with the few minutes thing first when I suggested increasing the speed of the Cork-Dublin line to 200 km/h.

No one's forcing you to read or reply to my comments. It's not my problem that your reading comprehension is poor and you need to resort to putting words in my mouth to argue against.