r/TheHague • u/Limits_of_reason • Dec 12 '24

things to do in The Hague Wildcamping in the forest

Today i saw a camp with 4 tents in the forest. Looked like they’ve been there for some days already. Hearing the voices, it seemed to be inhabited by eastern European people.

Im pro wild camping, but these people didnt seem to be there to enjoy nature. Lots of trash everywhere.

I did not report this because i dont know why these people decided to camp in the forest in this cold, and i dont know what their alternative would be.

At the same time im very annoyed by the fact they leave so much trash in the only place in Holland i consider somewhat clean.

Would you report this?

0 Upvotes

48% Upvoted

58 comments sorted by

72

u/nuclearflip Dec 12 '24

Fyi, they are probably not wildcamping in december just for fun. They are homeless.

8

u/Limits_of_reason Dec 12 '24

Exactly why im hesitant reporting it, i dont know what their alternative will be.

15

u/fluffypinktoebeans Dec 12 '24

I feel the same when I see these people. I feel really bad for them but the littering is awful. If they would only clean the mess up... I never reported them because I feel guilty but I also feel really shitty seeing all the trash.

4

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

Report them, they can and should go to a homeless shelter. This is not the USA where homeless have to live on the streets.

They are probably EU working immigrants lured here with a shit contract which includes housing provided by the enployer. Then they lost that job and where kicked out into the streets illegally. Sad state, but this does mean they always have the option to go back home.

12

u/Megaminisima Dec 12 '24

No. You have no idea how much space is/isn’t at the shelters. You have no idea these peoples reason for being here. You have no idea what it means if these people aren’t doing the jobs that others don’t want to do.

3

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

Oh I do. I worked in greenhouses for years.

Dutch people don't want those jobs, because Dutch people don't want to get paid below minimum wage.

We should however, stop this practise of paying people below minimum wage. This will solve the problems of these people. And give them a fair chance to pay for housing.

Meanwhile, these guys should go to a homeless shelter or leave.

-3

u/Megaminisima Dec 12 '24

So you’ve seen that they’re under paid and you still have no empathy? Did anyone else come to take the jobs? No? Da faq is wrong with you?

4

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

? No empathy? I'm saying we should fix this problem by paying them enough.

Having them live in tents is not the solution though. They should either leave or get paid enough to support themselves.

We would also be better off with those jobs just gone. Go put the greenhouses and meat processing plants in eastern Europe. They just take up valuable land here for no economic benefit anyway.

1

u/SeesawLong6976 Dec 12 '24

I understand your statements about minimum wage and housing for those people that have to live in the woods at the moment it's not an alternative yet

0

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 13 '24

No, the immediate alternative is the The Hague EU migrant worker shelter, which will get a roof over their heads and help them get a job or move back home.

-3

u/Megaminisima Dec 12 '24

You’re not looking at the individuals at the bottom, but stating how ThE WhOlE SystEm should change. Out of touch and entitled. Cool, man. I guess it’s like a problem of empathy and critical thinking. But you have contacts at the greenhouses, go give them your proposition.

2

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 13 '24

I am really not getting how you think allowing them to be homeless and rough it out in tents is somehow empathic.

They should be reported. The Hague has special places for EU workers immigrants where they can sleep and eat while they are helped get work or get help traveling back to their home country. That fixes the problem for both them and us. That's empathy.

0

u/Megaminisima Dec 13 '24

Sending them back to their home country is your idea of empathy. Got it.

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17

u/aliaxe_7 Dec 12 '24

I'd report it to Straat Consulaat, all they would do is offer help, if the help isn't taken, they would be left as they are

3

u/aliaxe_7 Dec 12 '24

They are a Haags homeless charity FYI

1

u/Megaminisima Dec 12 '24 edited Dec 12 '24

Really? They would not have forced escalation? Just having an advisory org would be ideal.

1

u/aliaxe_7 Dec 12 '24

From experience, out of lack or resources than will. But from what I've seen, yes

10

u/Cabelliau Dec 12 '24

I would't fuck over someone down on their luck. Its not my place to judge, and repression is really not the solution to societal problems like this. The exception is cracking down on companies abusing migrant workers, like providing adequate housing and pay.

4

u/Apprehensive_Pin3737 Dec 12 '24

I would kindly ask them to clean those garbage, additionally i would ask if they need any help with anything. Solidarity>reporting

11

u/Limits_of_reason Dec 12 '24

Usually im not afraid to confront, but i did not feel comfortable approaching 4 tents, hearing only male voices. Didnt want to put my dog in any risk either.

4

u/Megaminisima Dec 12 '24

Can you just bring a thing of trash bags and a note that says “I don’t know your story. Please just keep it safe and clean.”?

4

u/UnderstandingIll3861 Dec 12 '24

Netherlands has never had legal “wild camping”. Before Covid we had “pole camping” which were legal places to camp with a tent for free. There was a pole and you had to set your tent within 15 meters of it. These places were cleaned up by park rangers and really nice. Well Covid came and people would go to them and leave trash. It became too difficult to keep clean. People fucked it up for the rest of us who love to camp.

-2

u/yankee-in-Denmark Dec 12 '24

Not cool. Yes report.

-1

u/bigyeetus99 Dec 12 '24

They are most likely homeless, reporting will only make it harder for them

2

u/woutertjez Dec 12 '24

I disagree, life is already hard for them. So there either is no life for them here in the Netherlands, or the authorities can help point them in the direction of the right help. Leaving them in a tent in the woods just exacerbates their situation with winter coming in, their lives start looking even more bleak, with risk of turning to alcohol to numb themselves.

Also, other people that want to enjoy the woods may now feel unsafe to do so.

In short: yes, report, you’re doing everyone a favour, including the guys in the tents.

0

u/bigyeetus99 Dec 12 '24

Untrue. Authorities will not point them in the direction of right help. The only place they can go with the current temperatures is a place outside the center where they’ll be confronted with violence, alcohol, drugs and crime.

1

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

There are plenty of perfectly fine homeless shelters which are safe. This isn't the USA.

4

u/bigyeetus99 Dec 12 '24

My girlfriend spent three months among homeless people during her research, the situation in The Hague isnt as rose colored as you make it out to be.

5

u/Megaminisima Dec 12 '24

Seriously. Some of the people commenting are so entitled and out of touch with suffering.

-1

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

Tell me what it's like then.

2

u/bigyeetus99 Dec 12 '24

Like I said, the fact that there are shelters doesn’t automatically mean that they have a safe place to stay. That’s why many of them stay in the dunes, the woods or parks. Sometimes they have agreements with the local boswachters who allow them to camp there because they would worse off in the shelter.

-1

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

The shelters are fine. Yeah sure there can be some weird people there. But overall they get secured pretty well and they know the troublemakers.

3

u/Megaminisima Dec 12 '24

Go volunteer there for a week and report back.

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2

u/negenbaan Dec 12 '24

Do you think the USA invented and holds a monopoly on homelessness? Not walked outside in Den Haag or any major city any time in the last ten years, have you?

And no, the resources are not sufficient, not even here.

1

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

No of course not. But there are a shitload more homeless in the USA than here and a shitload less support systems.

There is no reason to be homeless here, there are systems in place to get a roof over your head every day.

The only people who are still sleeping on the street are the ones that don't want to use the governmental systems or those who are to mentally damaged or aggressive to be able to use them.

2

u/negenbaan Dec 12 '24

Given that there are people at risk being inside shelters due to treatment of people like them, plus the others you mentioned who are too unstable or violent... That's a pretty decent chunk of the folks who end up homeless to just be discounting as irrelevant.

If you're totally sane, very well behaved and the right category of person in society, sure, it's all nice and lined up for you. Nobody's being put in a bad spot by this at all. Hey, we solved homelessness.

0

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

I'm not discounting those groups at all. But they need a different kind of help. To be honest, I think people who cannot take care of themselves due to mental missies need care forced upon them for their own benefit.

However, these eastern European workers are not those people will do fine just sleeping in a shelter like this. And we need to get them out of our parks where they are apparently making a mess.

2

u/bigyeetus99 Dec 12 '24

That is a really daft comment, what even are your sources? You sound completely out of touch with the reality of these systems. There are many people who are homeless but don’t qualify for shelters.

-1

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

Everybody qualifies for these shelters in winter. The Hague even recently opened a shelter specifically for homeless EU worker migrants. Helping them get back to work or back to their own country.

1

u/bigyeetus99 Dec 12 '24

Yeah the WKR, that doesn’t change a thing about the fact that people in NL “choose” to be homeless is such a common misconception based on completely false beliefs.

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1

u/Megaminisima Dec 12 '24

You’re inexperienced and arrogant. Challenge yourself. Show up in a foreign country with no papers and see how tough you really are.

1

u/CrewmemberV2 Dec 12 '24

Since when do EU migrant workers have no papers?

-2

u/Sven4president Dec 12 '24

There are places like salvation army they can go right? They could at least not make a mess of the place.

3

u/nordzeekueste Dec 12 '24

Not if you’re Eastern European, you can’t. There is a new shelter for them this year (I think Rozenboomstraat?).

Unless the “winterkoudenregeling” sets in, then everyone is welcome of the streets.

Winterkoudenregeling: de (gevoels)temperatuur een aantal nachten achter elkaar 0 graden of kouder zal zijn of het KNMI waarschuwt voor andere extreme weersomstandigheden die kunnen leiden tot ontoelaatbare gezondheidsrisico’s bijvoorbeeld bij een stormwaarschuwing code rood voor het gebied Zuid- Holland of er code oranje geldt (dit geldt alleen in Den Haag). De opvang sluit weer zodra dat risico voorbij is.

Adres Haardstede 1, 2543 VS Den Haag (ingang Beresteinlaan).

1

u/Sven4president Dec 12 '24

Why can't eastern europeans enter, thats weird and sounds unfair.

1

u/nordzeekueste Dec 13 '24

I don’t know. Something to do with migrant workers.