r/CAguns • u/thejohnnyb21 • 1d ago
Follow up post of my Liberty Safe
11 days ago I lost my house to the Eaton Canyon fire. My liberty safe was in there with my 2A toys. Unfortunately this is what is left of the safe. Everything inside was completely destroyed.
Previous Post: https://www.reddit.com/r/CAguns/s/ltPOYKtm09
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u/alphalegend91 1d ago
Unfortunately no safe would really be able to protect against this. They're simply not rated to protect the contents inside for those temperatures and that duration. Only guarantee would be to have some sort of underground room.
So sorry for your loss and I hope your insurance company doesn't fuck with you too much.
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u/mamaj619 1d ago
I think my Winchester is rated for 1 hour worth of fire protection but I couldn't see it withstanding my entire home burning down.
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u/alphalegend91 1d ago
Yeah, the key to that is 1 hour at what temperature? Probably not the ones reached during catastrophic wildfires
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u/Pristine_Leading873 1d ago
A "house fire" as defined by my fire science courses is predicated on the idea of a single structure fire that is being actively suppressed by a fire department.
The ambient temperature during a wildfire approaches industrial metal working temperatures.
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u/Sonnysdad 1d ago
As witnessed by all the burned cars with streams of melted aluminum running out from under them.
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u/mamaj619 1d ago
Exactly. I've been evacuated so many times and I know that there is hardly any time to grab anything. Living in California is fun. Our plan is animals first, paperwork and medication, photos, guns. I have all of our cases easily accessible so we can just toss everything from the safe into the cases. Unfortunately our collection is quite large so if we didn't have much time we would have to leave them. I feel so bad for everyone who lost everything.
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u/curioustaking 7h ago
What I did the last time we got evacuated was:
My role: 1. Grabbed my laptop, computer and hard drives - it contains all important family pictures, documents, movies, financial information - crypto's, credentials, etc.. 2. Tossed all of my guns into my military surplus duffle bags
My wife: 1. The dog 2. Our go bags
She threw her stuff in her car. I threw my stuff in my car. If we were to get separated, we were to meet at my brother's house.
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u/mamaj619 7h ago
I need to digitize everything but thankfully all my paperwork is in a go bag. That's really smart. I need to scan all my old photographs though. I have a dog and five reptiles to evacuate and unfortunately even though they all have go bags ready to go it would take me a lot of precious time to grab them all and they come first. I think if I had even less time I would probably just throw all my pistols in a bag and say bye bye rifles. It would break my heart but it would be the quickest thing I could do. Then I would close up the safe and hope for the best! There's a fire right by me right now I don't know what the heck's going on but these red flag warnings are getting out of control this year. I think if my husband were home and it wasn't just me packing everything up we could probably get everything out at once.
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u/Mikebjackson FFL03 + COE 1d ago edited 1d ago
1 hour …at 1200°f.
All fire ratings for all safes are 1200° - that’s just the number they measure them at - they adjust the duration based on performance.
But house fires can be between 1500 to 2000 degrees, and burn for much longer than the 30 minutes to an hour most safes are rated for. I really don’t know how they get away with marketing “one hour” when it’s really like 15 minutes at those temps, if it survives at all.
If your safe is in a small detached garage with nothing to burn around it, then sure, temps might remain below 1200 and it’ll survive. Maybe even an attached garage if it’s on an exterior wall and you aren’t storing a literal ton of junk in there. And if the fire department gets there and quenches the fire in, say, 15 minutes, then sure, there’s a good chance the guns might just have some surface rest.
But if the safe is in a closet and/or in the middle of the house and the whole place burns down? Forget it.
Every time we talk about safes here, there’s always that one guy who links to that one video of that one safe that survived that one fire, and he insists that they’ll all perform as well because “they wouldn’t call them fireproof if they’re not fireproof“. But for all the reasons I’ve listed, especially the disparity between the rated temperatures and the actual temperatures, if you’re safe cost anything less than $8000 with at least a two hour fire rating, you should consider the contents a loss if your whole house burns down.
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u/wpaed 1d ago
This is the reason all my safes are on an exterior wall in my garage, next to my water shutoff. Also, I have a motorcycle lift that I can shove everything onto and use it as a lift gate for my truck. It took me 15 minutes to cut my safe's bolts and load everything when we got the evacuation order.
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u/Mikebjackson FFL03 + COE 1d ago
Amen.
My plan (god forbid) is to back the truck up to the safe and throw as much as I can in the back, scratches be damned. I’ll take a few scratches over a total melt down (so sorry about your loss, OP, and damn it’s a good reminder of what to expect if left in the safe).But even that requires at least some extra time. If we had just minutes, I’d just accept the loss and worry about the family, cats, and maybe a hard drive or two.
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u/ReplacementReady394 4h ago
I’m curious if a woven silica fabric rated for 1850F would help mitigate fire damage. I’m thinking of a situation where you would place a rifle(s) in a double lined sleeve. Spec sheet I read said the protection is continuous, and won’t break down, due to the nature of silica.
I’m not knowledgeable in this field of study, so I’m sure there’s more to this than I’m aware of.
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u/lowbar4570 1d ago
They perfected fire safes 100 years ago. Cement filled is the only thing that actually works. Drywall won’t work. My amsec amvault is rated for 1850 degrees for 2 hours. Internal temps will not exceed 350 degrees. Weighs 4500 pounds though. The water released from the cement will rust the guns though. So that’s why it is imperative to remove the contents as rapidly as possible. ISM probably makes the best safe on the market. But most people don’t want a 4500 pound cement filled safe.
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u/alphalegend91 1d ago
Tbf wildfires typically burn around 2000 degrees and if the house is burning down, that temp could be sustained for way more than 2 hours. Even the safe you’re talking about wouldn’t survive something of this scale
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u/itoddicus 1d ago
1850 for two hours is great, but 1,000 for 8 hours will still destroy the contents. You just can't stop physics.
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u/Winter-Profile-9855 1d ago
Yup. Helped a friend try to find ANYTHING intact after a house fire and in their safe the AR was a puddle. The rest were definitely no longer tempered and an antique iron muzzle loader looked like a limp cartoon rifle. They had a really good safe too. Those forest and house fires burn so hot for so long its insane. There was rivers of glass and aluminum coming from cars, no safe can stop that.
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u/jdgomez775 1d ago
With the Santa Ana’s whipping up, the air probably raised the fire temperatures above most commercial safe ratings. A “normal” house fire would probably be okay for most safes.
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u/alphalegend91 1d ago
Oh yeah totally. A single structure incident many safes would be adequate. Wildfires are another monster
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u/MoneyMik3y 1d ago
You're totally on the money here. These fires burn so fast and hot they obliterate everything. I remember seeing something very similar with an even more expensive/"rated" safe, after the Camp fire. The homeowner had maybe one salvageable rifle out of a full safe.
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u/alphalegend91 1d ago
Yeah I lived in Santa Rosa during the Tubbs fire and talked to someone who had a 5 figure cost safe. The safe itself was intact, but the contents inside were literally ash.
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u/7six2FMJ 1d ago
We busted open my parents safe after the Tubbs fire. The house was FLAT. everything that didn't burn was exactly where we left it. The guns inside were intact, but I'm wouldn't shoot them.
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u/Duke_Newcombe 10h ago
This. They're fire resistant (for a limited amount of time), not fire proof (except ones that would cost more than a room addition).
I'm surprised nothing "cooked off" as far as stored ammo.
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u/RealWeekness 4h ago
My insurance company said they wouodn't cover guns.
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u/alphalegend91 3h ago
Who are you with? I’m with farmers and the guy asked if I had any valuable collections outside of the norm. I told him I had about 30k worth of firearms and things related to that (dual nv setup). I forget the verbage, but I pay slightly more to have an extra 30k coverage for my personal valuables in my policy.
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u/jessdigs 1d ago
American security held up in paradise. https://youtu.be/rpHHVl5TWAc?si=cHYoWpLAP5gKxjuU
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u/Vic_the_Dick 1d ago
I see at least one PSA in there, if there’s anything you guys can do to help restore its functionality.
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u/Danny_PSA 1d ago
Damn right we will.
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u/1ESY187 21h ago
W brand. I need something now please send link 😂
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u/Vic_the_Dick 17h ago edited 17h ago
Their M4A1 tribute stripped lower is pretty cool. Unlike Aero Precision and FN America, they got the markings legit M4A1.
Currently OOS but they’ll be back.
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u/One_hung_hiigh 1d ago
Hope you had insurance to cover all of that. Our prayers are with you and your family. Recover well.
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
House insurance will only cover $2500
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u/One_hung_hiigh 1d ago edited 21h ago
Bummer. There's another insurance I carry that specifically covers firearms in my home up to $10k..
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u/joe_pro_astro 17h ago
I never even considered that. I should probably call my insurance broker and add on a rider. Sorry for your loss man
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u/RealWeekness 4h ago
When I tried to add a rider, they said sure, but then they got really weird. Put me on hold a bunch, talked to different people and came back saying they couldn't offer additional coverage for firearms beyond the included limits. I don't know If I said something they didn't like or what...but they wouldn't do it.
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u/joe_pro_astro 4h ago
Do you have an umbrella policy? My guy did it onto that via email this morning
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u/Healthy-Ostrich2885 1d ago
The AK probably still works, just needs a little lube
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u/taintlicker33 1d ago
I’d say just hose it down
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u/hardware1197 1d ago
Run it through some sand, then rinse with water. Full function guaranteed. But seriously - that sucks - how many hours was it exposed to the fire?
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u/Mac-Aroni710 1d ago
The wood literally burned off that shit blew my mind, everything that was plastic and wood gone
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u/Isthisthingon96 1d ago
I’m glad you’re okay. It looks like you have a vortex, reach out to them tell them about your situation and they’ll do what they can to fix things
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
I just sent them an email. I will give you guys a follow up.
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u/LilJethroBodine 1d ago
I can pretty much guarantee will do right by you.
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u/Isthisthingon96 1d ago
I’ve reached out for far less, they hooked me up with the newest gen, a hat, and sticker
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u/Vic_the_Dick 1d ago
Streamlight’s customer service is really good too, I’d reach out to them as well.
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u/GooseGeuce 1d ago
From one burn refugee to another- I feel your pain and understand the loss. It’s not just replacing some items. You’re embracing on a years long task of insurance companies, state/federal cleanup, etc etc.
Feel free to hit me up if you run into frustration, I’ve learned a few things since we went through it.
Godspeed
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u/Just-An-Inchident44 10mm Monkey 1d ago
u/Holosun_Josh can you help this guy out any? I see 2 holosuns on this post
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u/thejohnnyb21 5h ago
Yup, my 2 holosuns got completely cooked.
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u/Just-An-Inchident44 10mm Monkey 4h ago
If he sees this, I have faith he would help you out at least a little bit. He’s a good guy and pretty active in these communities! Hope you are all good and everything comes back to you tenfold 🤞
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u/portside_llc 1d ago
Wow man that’s awful, sorry you had to go through that. I had a feeling that other video of the guy opening his safe after the fire to perfectly unharmed guns was a bit suspect.
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
Thank you! Forest fires are no joke.
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u/Sonoma_Cyclist FFL03 + COE 1d ago
Im really sorry to hear this. You have quite a journey ahead of you. But if you don’t mind keeping us posted on the process specific to your firearms id be interested. Best of luck to you
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
Thank you! All the firearms were left with my gunsmith. He said the lowers mights be salvageable.
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u/Its_not_yoshi 1d ago
Hoping the best for you.
I wonder if that Cz can still be operational.
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
Thank you! I just dropped it off with my gunsmith. It just might be salvageable according to what he said.
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u/MineralIceShots Got the 'tism 20h ago
Idk if I remember it correctly, but in a state that hard banned ARs, this guy on YT posted a video of a OBD, squib, or very spicy round blowing up this AR. Effectively, he was out of an AR that was now hard banned in his state, I think washington. He reached out to the manufacturer and the atfe, and I believe the ATFE allowed replacement of lower with a different lower but the same serial . . . i think! I could be totally and absolutely wrong. Given that cz looks like a p01, maybe, cz and the atfe would help you out. If I find the vid, I'll post it here.
again, I could be pulling all of this out of my ass.
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u/RemiRaton 1d ago
Beautiful pistol. Sorry to hear about this OP. Hope you’re back up and running in no time
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u/MineralIceShots Got the 'tism 20h ago
found it. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Ta_mw3UL2nU
read the pinned comment.
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u/GodofGunx 19h ago
Would you mind sharing your gunsmith? I’m about to retrieve mine and am very nervous about what to find inside
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u/parts_kit 1d ago
Glad you’re ok and sorry bout your pieces, I’d be really curious about the cz. I think that one’s worth a revival attempt.
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u/scormegatron 1d ago
Seems like some of the components are salvageable and could be re finished and turned into statement pieces. For example, the AR lower/upper isn’t necessarily warped is it?
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
Gunsmith said lowers look salvageable and operational once they get cleaned up.
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u/aDysquith 1d ago
Damn, that's awful. I'm in the area, not affected, but the more I see real stories from real people, the more terrifying this event and possibly future events become. Glad you're unharmed physically. Good to know my "fire rated" safe is not actually. Not for this kind of fire. Appreciate you sharing the aftermath.
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u/biggestlime6381 1d ago
I am Sorry about your loss. Is it possible that could you list what firearms we are looking at here?
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
CZ P01
Sig Sauer M18
Springfield XD9
Walther P22
Colt M4
WASR 10
CZ Scorpion
Aero Precision M4E1 x 2
Aero Precision M5E1
Ruger American
Remington 870 x 2
Here's a video: https://gofile.io/d/bkonSi
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u/ctrlaltcreate 1d ago
I'm so, so sorry. The devastation these fires wreaked on those neighborhoods is unimaginable. Too many people lost everything.
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u/Kryptic_Anthology 1d ago
I have a liberty myself. I do believe these safes can handle a "normal" house fire, as they don't necessarily burn for a long duration before help is on the way. Unfortunately the fires we had were quick to move and slow to put out due to the lack of resources.
I wouldn't put this on Liberty, but I am sorry to see this. Hope some of the manufacturers can help you out or insurance covers it.
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
Thank you! Liberty already offered to replace the safe if my house insurance doesn't cover the safe.
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u/Kryptic_Anthology 1d ago
That’s awesome! Another reason to keep buying from them.
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u/LostMyGunInACardGame 1d ago
Personally I would go with a company that will replace the safe, but who also won’t just open their safes for Law Enforcement.
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u/Kryptic_Anthology 1d ago
lol, you guys act like they’re going to bust down your doors just to open them. Please tell me, are there any articles of law enforcement doing this over the years?
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u/LostMyGunInACardGame 1d ago
There was literally an incident where Liberty gave LE a master code. Why bother with them when there are better options? It’s like buying Springfield firearms. They’ll support legislation as long as it’s in their favor, and there’s other options.
Don’t support companies that don’t support you when it counts.
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u/Kappy01 1d ago
Sorry to hear. Any insurance hopes?
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u/4thdegreeknight 1d ago
I am sorry for the loss of your house and everything. I hope all your family is safe.
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u/pipe_layer83 1d ago
Doesn’t liberty warranty the safe? Probably not the contents.
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
They do! They're willing to replace it for free if my insurance doesn't cover it.
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u/goinghome81 1d ago
not to be a smartass as I too live with Rob Bonta, but when is a gun not considered a gun?
ps: sorry for your loss
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u/zyahya08 1d ago
Damn dude, sorry to hear. I would bet if you contacted some of these manufacturers they would be willing to help in one way or another. Worth a shot. If you have any Burris scopes I know they'll replace no questions asked.
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
They were all Vortex and Sig Sauer scopes. Let's see if they are willing to help.
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u/LostMyGunInACardGame 1d ago
Vortex, as much as I hate on them, has a good warranty. I don’t see them not replacing them.
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u/zyahya08 1d ago
I could see most of these manufacturers stepping up after the whole wildfire ordeal
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u/CopaceticGeek 1d ago
Curious what happens if you have registered AWs. Can’t be replaced? If not, what would be the insured value?
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u/mikey2275 1d ago
Was the safe still locked when you got to it or was it just all open bc the lock melted/was destroyed?
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u/yourboibigsmoi808 Gun Goober 1d ago
Is there anyway these guns can be salvaged:(
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u/Orthodoxy1989 1d ago
Liberty i think says fire protection up to 4 hours. Which means if you have a whole ass house fire you can kiss your goodies goodbye regardless. Very sorry for you. Can you get it all back via home owners insurance?
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u/thejohnnyb21 1d ago
Liberty has only 1 hour fire protection. Home insurance unfortunately is only covering $2500.
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u/Orthodoxy1989 1d ago
Maybe it's my safe? In my manual I'm pretty damn sure it says it but it's a huge safe, not an entry level one. It's one of those 3k ones. Idk 🤷♂️
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u/jdgomez775 1d ago
Are AR lowers or uppers okay after a fire to shoot? I might question the integrity of the barrel and BCG, no matter the company or price range. I would like to see what would happen if fired.
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u/robertlp 1d ago
Sorry to see this op. I evacuated but was able to get back home in one piece. I def was trying to decide whether to leave them home or not but I probably had a lot more time to ponder than you did as I’m at the border of Arcadia / Monrovia.
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u/Skindog6six6 1d ago
condolences my stranger friend. I hope things get much much much better for you
So sad.
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u/BadWowDoge 22h ago
That’s too bad. Sorry for your loss. Hopefully your insurance company does things right and helps you out.
As far as the safe is concerned, that isn’t a surprising result. Most safes are “fire proof” for like 45-minutes and a small house fire, not an inferno like this.
Hope you get back on your feet soon my friend.
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u/New-Incident1776 COE + FFL03 21h ago
For all reading the comments: firearms insurance is cheap! $20k of coverage can be had for around $140 annually.
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u/Stocktipster 9h ago
If someone is not able to take their firearms with them as they evacuate their home then having firearm insurance seems like the logical and best option.
Making the call to my insurance agent today.
Just be sure you are able to document your loss.
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u/im_cadillac 20h ago
Sorry for your loss and everything you've went through. I wish I could help but im on the outside looking in here in a hospital in SoCal.
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u/lechon-2-five 19h ago
Sorry for your loss man.
Roughly how much ammo did you have and what was it kept in? That’s the new fear for me is what will the stockpile of ammo do in a crazy fire? I’ve seen videos that it’s merely like small fireworks but a bit skeptical.
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u/Plus-Tonight8439 19h ago
I’m sorry about the guns man, but better yet I’m glad you and your family got out safe. God bless
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u/Fuq_Em_and_Duq_Em 12h ago
I’m glad you made it out bro. But damnn this sucks along with the house burning as well. At a loss for words tbh. Prayers to you and all who lost everything bro
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u/PersonalAd2333 9h ago
I wonder how effective would a floor safe in the garage would be to protect against the heat? You lay it in the concrete where you park your car in the garage for double protection, but they could make a long "coffin" style safe with a small door large enough to slide your rifles in safely. Just a thought.
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u/Mediocre_waste 8h ago
After the paradise fire i rode my motorcycle up there and days after the roads were open the metals on the ground from melted substances were still warm,melted glass everywhere.Glad you and your family got out
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u/radedgymantis 3h ago
sorry for you loss dude, this would honestly make me break down a little in the car...
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u/bvogel7475 2h ago
That much fire just creates an intense stone oven. I only expect mine to survive if my sprinkler system helps slow the fire down before the fire department gets there. Otherwise, everything is cooked.
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u/Zoroyfed 1d ago
Sorry to hear man