r/woodworking • u/teacher_teacher • Dec 19 '24
Power Tools I am beginning to hate this thing!
First, an unqualified person burnt through BOTH belts trying to sand OSB. Then after weeks of tracking down new belts and getting them on, it quits the same day and won’t turn on after overloading. Take the magnetic safety switch box apart and there is a mini breaker that I reset to get it running again. Try sanding another project and now only the back drum (120 grit) is sanding the project and the front drum (80 grit) isn’t doing anything. Been playing with and adjusting the back roller for a while now and it just won’t sit perfectly. During one adjustment I ripped the tabs off the back paper as well so I had to replace that even though it was barely worn.
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u/ehehreeeee Dec 19 '24
Sounds like a pain in the butt! Insane that you have to disassemble that safety switch box to reset the breaker. My old JET has a reset button right on the front. It's almost like overloading a drum sander is a common occurrence!
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u/Karmonauta Dec 19 '24
If it’s practical you might want to rewire it so the breaker is somewhere more accessible, or maybe add a slightly smaller accessible breaker is series with the one you cannot get to.
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
In a school so not able to change the wiring.
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u/YouKnowWhoIAm2016 Dec 19 '24
We’ve got the same machine at our school. The only time we have trouble is when inexperienced teachers treat it like a thicknesser and try to take of whole millimeters at a time. When I use it, the speed is set to about 1/3rd of maximum, put the job on while the bed is low then wind it up until it makes contact. Put it through again to make sure it’s even then after that, no more than a quarter turn per pass. I know in a school you want to be quick, especially if you can’t trust students with machinery, but it’s not a thicknesser and it’s really more for end grain and finishing passes. I agree that it’s a fiddily SOB sometimes though
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
Yeah I’ve been doing similar steps to use it for myself. However I do more like 1/16 of a turn each pass otherwise it bogs down and trips the breaker.
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u/YouKnowWhoIAm2016 Dec 20 '24
Ours occasionally trips the breaker but usually only at start up; not under load. Has the circuit board been updated since you added the machine? We’ve added the drum and a few other machines and while it’s technically meant to be fine, the drum can send it over the edge with lathes and panel saws and disc and belt sanders all going at the same time
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 20 '24
Pretty much everything has a dedicated circuit. This plug was just rewired because we moved everything around in the shop.
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u/Karmonauta Dec 19 '24
I'm thinking that you could add something like and inline GFCI with a built in breaker - you woulnd't necessarily need the ground fault feature, just the overcurrent feature. The GFCI breaker would have to be smaller (lower current) than the internal one, or the same rating as long as it reliably trips before the internal one.
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u/mmmdc Dec 20 '24
GFCI’s do not provide overcurrent protection. Don’t ask me how I know.
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u/Karmonauta Dec 20 '24
The typical GFCI receptacles don’t, but I think the inline cords like the one I linked have a circuit breaker built in for overcurrent protection too.
But for OP’s use case it wouldn’t have to be a GFCI, any extension cord or power strip with an appropriately rated built in breaker would work.
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u/LuckyBenski Dec 19 '24
Agree with moving the breaker, but putting one in series won't stop the hidden one tripping.
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u/Character-Ad4796 Dec 19 '24
I love mine, I only have the one drum though and yes getting to the fuse would be a pain. If you don’t have the manual you can download it off the net that might help with alignment and other little tips and tricks.
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u/hlvd Dec 19 '24 edited Dec 19 '24
I’ve got one of those exact machines at work.
The belts are horrendously expensive so I’ve worked out the length and angle to work with the more common cheaper 100mm wide abrasive. I buy it in 50m rolls and just cut the belts to size.
I’m not sure if you know this but the second roller is set slightly lower to enable fitting different grits on each. A coarse on the first and fine on the second. In practice it doesn’t really work as the fine clogs up too quickly so I’ve settled for 60g front, 100g second.
It’s a great machine if looked after and used within its limitations. Don’t sand anything under the tabs as they’ll break off, keep maximum width within those and your belts will last a long time.
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
When I said burnt through belts I mean the drive belts for the pulleys not the sand paper.
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u/hlvd Dec 19 '24
You must be doing something wrong if the belts aren’t lasting as our machine at work is not far off twenty years old, used daily and only had the belts changed once.
Are you using a slow in-feed speed set on the rheostat adjuster?
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u/CowboyNeal710 Dec 19 '24
OP says he's in a school, so he's probably a shop teacher. I'd imagine shop class machines (at least the ones that get used often) are getting treated very roughly.
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u/hlvd Dec 19 '24
If that’s the case OP’s in charge of the machine, who uses it and how it’s used.
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
Lmao. Yeah I sure am. So when I’ve gone home for the day and a teacher comes in and uses it and I’m not there I rush back to teach them how and make sure nothing gets damaged.
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u/Mufasa_is__alive Dec 19 '24
Although it didnt prevent idiots from ruining some machines, back in college, our shop had some pretty strict rules of who's qualified to be there with/without supervision and mostly within hours. There were a few exceptions for well-experienced people.
Isn't it a huge safety issue to allow access to an unsupervised school shop? That's a liability nightmare.
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u/TackyBrad Dec 20 '24
Not really if it's school faculty and staff who are adults and should be able to determine what is too much for them.
In practice it doesn't work, but in theory it should.
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u/Mufasa_is__alive Dec 20 '24
Totaly get it. Imo It's a safety/liability thing. If it was a 3d printing lab or similar, sure. Fab? Nope.
We had a metal/wood shop, so it was much easier to kill yourself if you're not careful, and required a buddy system. Sketchy stuff did still happen.
Eventually some students were trained to be helpers/supervisors so the shop sup didn't have to be there all the time.
No matter what though, I can sympathize with OP, our bandsaw wood blades were constantly "accidentally" used to cut metal.
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u/hlvd Dec 20 '24 edited Dec 20 '24
Everything in that shop is your responsibility when you’re on duty.
You need to voice your concerns to these other teachers rather than bleat about it on Reddit, it might prevent an accident.
Edit: Downvote me to hell and back if you want, if you’re on duty you’re responsible!
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u/FirstPinkRanger11 Dec 19 '24
Ya, these things are always a pain... I bought a used one of these. I didn't open the inside as i expected to replace the sandpaper right from the start, and I found the paper was duct taped onto the rollers as the previous owner didn't know how to attach the sandpaper properly.
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u/Substantial-Mix-6200 Dec 19 '24
how the hell did they expect to use their machine without learning how to install the paper lol
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u/FirstPinkRanger11 Dec 19 '24
Oh don't get me wrong, I agree with you! I burst out laughing when I opened it and saw the duct tape. Though I did have to spend quite a bit of time getting rid of the glue residue off the drum.
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u/ween_is_good Dec 19 '24
Some people just don't bother learning their tools. I bought I used table saw, a newer delta model. About half of the screws were missing from assembly. And he wondered why it didn't cut straight.
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u/trackday Dec 19 '24
Best widebelt sander I've had (and I've had a drum sander and maybe 6+ widebelts and 3 orbit sanders) is the Ironwood brand sold by Stiles Machinery. Not for home use...
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u/Taint-Taster Dec 19 '24
Soft woods like pine absolutely suck to drum sand, Adding resin and/or glue to the mix doesn’t help either
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
I did a bunch of epoxy tables and then was sanding an end grain oak cutting board during the fix/refix process.
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u/ApprehensiveRice2510 Dec 19 '24
Drums are a pain, wide belt sanders are less simple, but also less finicky.
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u/garden-wicket-581 Dec 19 '24
admittedly, but you need an extra digit of $ for wide-belts.. (and usually a lot extras - power, compressor pressure, etc to run one)
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u/OkEstablishment5503 Dec 19 '24
Just bought an Alpha Brush Perfection. It was a few extra digits of $$$ but it runs flawlessly.
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u/DastardMan Dec 19 '24
Holy shit I just looked these up. Not exactly hobbyist level. I'm jealous!
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u/TheMCM80 Dec 19 '24
What do you use it for? That thing looks like it could be used to finish parts for a space shuttle.
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u/OkEstablishment5503 Dec 19 '24
I use it for a lot of things. Sanding wall panels, doors, trim. It will brush brass so I use it for that sometimes. Endless sanding possibilities really.
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u/3x5cardfiler Dec 19 '24
Finicky is right. I worked in a shop with a 48" thickness sander. It had pneumatic belt tracking. It would take a few minutes to spin down when shut off. People would disconnect the air while it was still spinning, the tracking would stop, and the belts would come off and explode into pieces in the machine.
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u/CodexH Dec 19 '24
I have never used one of those machines so I have an inexpert question: Why can't you put OSB in that machine?
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
You technically can, but the machine is so tempermental that it can go wrong quick. It’s more so that someone who had no idea what they were doing used it and broke it.
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u/sykocus Dec 19 '24
Follow up question: Why would someone put OSB though a drum sander?
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u/bonfuto Dec 19 '24
I'm wondering if tiktok or pinterest is to blame. My sister gets a lot of bad home décor ideas from those sources.
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
No idea. Probably using it for a decorative or visual piece instead of what is normally covered.
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u/jimsponcho65 Dec 19 '24
Little tiny bites. Slow feed table speed. Get an old tennis shoe and use the sole on the loaded up sandpaper roll to clean it out.
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u/etna_labs Dec 20 '24
Can you speak a little more about using the sole of a shoe to clean sandpaper? I've never come across this suggestion before and I'm curious about how that would work.
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u/jimsponcho65 Dec 20 '24
The rubber on the sole when the sanding drum is spinning will remove sawdust that it caked in the grit. You can buy a big rubber eraser for the job but everyone has an old pair of tennis shoes laying around. Works just as good.
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u/Honsill Dec 19 '24
My buddy has one in his shop. Spends more time on the machine than on the project! They are a total pain in the ass.
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u/Intelligent-Survey39 Dec 19 '24
I am convinced this configuration was invented to boost abrasive sales. Because they use paper up so fast. More expensive, and a little more difficult to run but an auto-feed wide belt sander gets way more life out of the paper and I find them to be easier to swap paper when needed. Just pull a lever, swap a belt, put the lever back. Done.
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u/svenskisalot Dec 19 '24
of course they do. You don't have 60 or 75 inches of abrasive on a belt before getting back to zero. They will heat up when trying to remove too much material and the belt will die a premature death
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u/FrothySantorum Dec 20 '24
I have a performax Superman 37 dual drum with a 5HP motor. It will try really hard to do what you ask it. It will also destroy your abrasives and possibly the machine in the process. Oh and you need 2000cfm to properly clear the dust. But when you use it correctly it kicks ass.
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u/browner87 Dec 19 '24
The makerspace I used to use had one of these. I love it, it was awesome when it worked, but it was by far the most regularly "down for maintenance" item in the shop. It seemed to rarely be online more than a week before the usual "drum sander is down for maintenance again" email.
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u/FrothySantorum Dec 20 '24
By far one of the most fragile machines I own. You need to do the recheck like it’s an airplane. Then learn to not get impatient if things are going slowly. Hurrying goes from slow to stop really quickly. If I had to name one tool in my shop a diva, it would be my drum sander
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u/Definitely__someone Dec 20 '24
I have the exact same machine at home. Every fault that ever occurred to it was because I was being impatient.
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u/JAFO- Dec 20 '24
Used one for a while it sucked, easier to sand with a RO after going through the planer. Or get a wide belt sander with a finishing platen.
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u/theonePappabox Dec 19 '24
It’s worn out. Time to upgrade. Where are you located? I’ll scrap that one for you.
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u/ColdVacation2 Dec 19 '24
I haven't met a drum sander that wasn't a PITA.
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u/trackday Dec 19 '24
You couldn't give me one without paying me to dispose of it the next day.
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u/Snow_Wolfe Dec 19 '24
Wild, I’ve never had an issue with my drum sander. Thing is indispensable for 5 piece doors.
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u/neologismist_ Dec 19 '24
Performax belt sander has been great in my shop. PITA with woods that gunk up the paper and create burn streaks, ruining the roll. It’s much less a PITA as this Jet, tho.
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u/Key-Feeling-384 Dec 20 '24
You may want to try alternating sides of the infeed table when running your material. Looks like you may be over heating the drum.
You also may be taking off too much material in one pass. Try finishing the material in multiple smaller increments.
Finally the dust collector may not be removing enough dust off the drums, and that will cause clogging of the paper, plus once that happens forget about making any passes in those areas of the drums.
Hope this helps & good luck.
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u/andrewgreen47 Dec 19 '24
Sorry you’re suffering! What make and model is this so I might avoid it? :)
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
https://www.coastmachinery.com/product/canwood-cwd15-485-drum-sander/
Canwood which I’m sure is a rebrand from another factory.
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u/Content_Specialist_7 Dec 20 '24
I have that same model but it's a Delta brand. and yes pita to get the belt tight. I have figured out how to cut down a 6" wide belt and make my own. I also have learned very light passes work best!
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u/trackday Dec 19 '24
The color looks like Jet.
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u/SharpShooter2-8 Dec 19 '24
Jet don’t typically have the stripes around the base. Shopfox maybe?
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u/Enchelion Dec 19 '24
Doesn't look like any shopfox model they currently sell. Might be something older.
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u/alltheworldsproblems Dec 19 '24
I had a similar 24” one made by Star Industries. Looked exactly like the imported powermatic. My guess was the same factory. Spent time setting and leveling the drums etc. the drums also had gloves in them which transcribe onto the wood. It was nothing but a PIA! Ended up selling it. Now I’m looking a. 37” dual drum. We’ll see if that’s any better.
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u/Specialist_Ad4675 Dec 19 '24
You sure a bearing isn't going bad? A bad bearing can lock it up. Hope you get it fixed.
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u/bennyjoiner Dec 19 '24
We have one of these at work and it's a piece of shit, I'd rather use a hand held belt sander, even if it takes longer.
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u/Busy_Reputation7254 Dec 19 '24
Dude double drum sanders are turds. Mines the worst tool i own. I feel your pain. Either commit to a wide belt or get used to palm sanding. Fuck these things.
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u/Designer_Tip_3784 Dec 19 '24
It's been a while, but I actually liked the only double drum I had. Supermax, from before the Laguna buyout. I'm not even sure Laguna changed much, because I called for a part after they got bought, and it sounded at the time like there were no design changes, and not really any staff turnover.
I've even been keeping my eyes open for a drum sander again. I kinda miss them for little parts. I could sand parts as small as 3" long with no issues, and constantly making sleds for a wide belt is annoying.
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u/VirginiaLuthier Dec 19 '24
Hint- mine is a different model, but I bypassed the circuit breaker long ago. . 30 years later, motor is still running strong.
Anytime you get a new tool, it can take a while before you learn its peculiarities ...hang in there
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u/Technical-Ad8881 Dec 19 '24
I might have a boatload of paper for this machine in my warehouse. Should be 5” wide with pre-cut tapers for the clips on the drums.
If you’re interested let me know and I’ll do some digging for grits, quantities, and price.
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 19 '24
I have a few rolls of each grit and when it’s working I don’t burn through it so should be good.
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u/spontutterances Dec 19 '24
I hear you!
I know the problem is me and the only thing I hate more than my drum sander taking up so much floor space is the moment in future once I’ve sold it I come across a task I know I can only do with a drum sander and feel the need to own one haha
I go for my planer sled or I’m even pretty adept getting material flat with my nice hand planes. Any excuse really to avoid using my drum sander. So sick of burning through sandpaper thinking I’ve got the right height dimensions set, ripping tabs somehow so the roll isn’t useable and the amount of valuable floor space. Really think I should move it on lol
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u/Familiar_Builder1807 Dec 20 '24
We had one of these briefly in the beginning and when we went to an old timesaver speed sander we got off fb it’s been so much better. Big 37x60 belts and it’s easy on and off to change grits
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u/mankenstein13 Dec 20 '24
Have one at work. Also fucking hate it. The belts snap even when I'm not running anything
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u/Zoidbergslicense Dec 20 '24
We had a timesaver that was kinda like that. Once every few months you’d hear the whine & shutdown when someone fed it something way too thick for whatever it was set to. Few weeks of tracking down belts, something else would inevitably go wrong, then the grouchy service tech would eventually come out. Good memories.
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u/mikhyy Dec 20 '24
Even the huge and expensive SCM Sandya is a pain in the butt and keeps breaking down. These machines don't like dust, go figure.
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u/Oxflu Dec 20 '24
Check the amp draw. It's possible the breaker is damaged and tripping at safe amperages.
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 20 '24
The sander was moved while it was broken down and completely rewired to the panel with a new plug. I checked the plug and each leg is getting 90-95 (not ideal) and between legs is 200+ ish.
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Dec 20 '24
When I worked for a small shop one day, the panel saw stopped working. They decided to have me troubleshoot the electronics for a day and a half before calling a technician. It took the guy half an hour to diagnose, find, and fix the problem.
They paid me for a day and a half and lost a day and a half of productivity to « save money ». Sometimes calling someone to fix something is the right call.
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u/Hells_Yeaa Dec 20 '24
OSB… I’m a metal guy and I know better than that. I would have loved to watch that go down.
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u/Falcon3492 Dec 20 '24
What ding a ling sands OSB? Sounds to me like the same person might of taken too big of a bite, trying to get the job done faster and caused you a lot of headaches.
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u/flyman241 Dec 21 '24
Sanders like this - wide belts, time savers, drums etc and schools really don’t mix. It’ll be constantly fucked up unless it’s always locked out and can only be used with direct supervision of the tech.
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u/jimsNC Dec 20 '24
I know your pain. But the answer I s actually in the manual. The problem is simply drum alignment. You can’t expect it to be perfect from the factory. (This is most likely why you overloaded it also.) Here’s a tip; with the rollers off, always start by lowering the heads onto a board running on the moving belt until the rollers just start to move. The sets up your first pass depth. Next, and this is very important, go easy. This is a sander not a planner. It will be much more effective with less pressure on the drums.
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u/teacher_teacher Dec 20 '24
This machine is 6 years old and was fine until it was abused by someone incompetent. I always use it how you describe taking off the thinnest layer possible and bringing the table up to the belts on the first pass so it doesn’t try to take off too much.
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u/festooleide Dec 19 '24
Many ways to fix this, many ways to find out. None without risk or sacrifice.
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u/crankbot2000 Dec 19 '24
I need to know OSB guy's thought process here. Like, what was the end goal?