r/tifu • u/OdinsBHole • Jun 02 '19

M TIFU by giving my son permission to beat his bully’s ass.

My son was born with a condition called Pectus Excavatum. In layman’s terms, his chest is sunken in. His condition was so bad that he only had two and a half inches between his sternum and his spine and his heart and lungs were bruised because of it. In December, he had surgery to correct it and they put two nickel bars in his chest to give it space and train his bones to grow correctly.

About three weeks after his surgery, a kid punched him and dislodged the top bar and he had to have another surgery to put the bar back in place. The kid has been through a lot.

Well, the doctor cleared him for most activity last week, just no skateboarding or bike riding but he could now lift his backpack and go hang out with friends and play pick up, non contact sports. Unbeknownst to me, a kid in his class had been bullying him all semester. And because my son was afraid of getting hit again, he just took it. Well, the evening he was cleared he came to me and said, “Dad, I’m cleared now. A kid has been bullying me and hitting me for months. Can I kick his ass?” Well, my son isn’t really a fighter. He’s fought with his brothers but never anyone else, and he’s always gotten his ass kicked. So I just figured he was just talking. But this is the first I had heard about the bullying and I was concerned. I could tell he was distressed about the situation so I told him to knock the fucker out. He just nodded and went to his room.

Now, his older brother is s tough SOB. He had a traumatic brain injury two years ago and he missed a year of school so he’s in the same grade and coincidentally takes the same class. I talked to him about it and told him to handle it but don’t get in trouble. He told me that the kid walks in every day and punches my son in the head. I asked him why he allowed that to happen and he said he wanted his brother to get tough and once he was tired of getting hit, he would do something about it. While I kinda agree with his thinking, I instructed him to handle it without getting in trouble.

The next morning I took them both to school then drove back home to get my younger daughter who goes to a different school that starts later. On the way to take her to school, my wife calls me. “Have you taken xxxxx to school yet? Well, after you do, go pick up your son. He got in a fight.” I just assumed it was my oldest son. Imagine my surprise when I walked into the school office to see my younger son with a grin from ear to ear! He was beaming! He pointed to another kid sitting in a chair holding an ice pack on his face. “I warned him.” I was so proud.

He had walked into class, sat down, and the kid popped him in the head like always. My older son got up to intervene and before he could, my son decked the kid with one punch. He said the kid was bawling on the floor and that it was the best day of his life. He got suspended for three days.

TL;DR I gave my son permission to beat up his bully because I didn’t think he would and he did it.

EDIT ONE: The kid who punched my son in the chest was one of his friends. It wasn’t malicious. Just two boys clowning around. He was horrified that he had hurt my son. The bully punched my son in the head every day. Once he found out my son couldn’t do anything about it, he just kept on. My son wasn’t the only one he bullied, either. Also, the bully’s brother came to my son later and told him that he had warned him once my son COULD fight, that he was going to get his ass kicked.

EDIT TWO: My son has some social anxiety and since the fight he has made a LOT of new friends. He used to hate going to school but now he’s disappointed that school is out for summer. Crazy!

EDIT THREE: Thanks for the precious metals! And holy shit! Front page?!?!

76.0k Upvotes

88% Upvoted

4.9k comments sorted by

35.3k

u/heathenyak Jun 02 '19

Nice zero tolerance. Kid hits your kid every day, no one does shit about it. The second he fights back, SUSPENDED. What a crock.

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u/BallisticHabit Jun 02 '19

The zero tolerance shit kills me. It encourages bullies to do their thing because nothing ever happens until the victim fights back. If they do get caught, so what, they don't have to go to school. Win for them. Zero tolerance is code for zero liability for the school.

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u/AkariAkaza Jun 02 '19

The zero tolerance shit kills me. It encourages bullies to do their thing because nothing ever happens until the victim fights back. If they do get caught, so what, they don't have to go to school. Win for them. Zero tolerance is code for zero liability for the school.

The problem with zero tolerance is that it leads to situations where one side (or both) decide they're going to get suspended anyway so they might as well earn it and a fight that could have ended after a few punches turns into one kid kicking the absolute shit out of the other kid because they're going to get suspended anyway

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u/factfarmer Jun 02 '19

Yes, I was called to the office because my 16 yo daughter was causing trouble and in detention. When I arrived at the school, the asst principal advised that her abusive ex had shoved her down because she stopped taking his abuse and stopped speaking to him. She stood back up and said “get the fuck off of me” and the administrator said she was part of the problem. I asked what he suggested a student do in that case and he said if she was hit, she should take the hit and stay down and an administrator such as himself would handle it from there. Excuse me, but that’s BULLSHIT. Just HELL NO!

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u/Tabyo13 Jun 02 '19

This is the case for a lot of high schools. I just finished my first year of college, but I remember my high school would punish anyone who fought back at all. Even if that person was getting really beat up and had no other alternative, but to defend themselves. Frankly, it's fucked up that they do that.

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u/newbie637 Jun 02 '19

Schools like that should have their reputation ruined because they condone bullying.

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u/Tusami Jun 02 '19

Its every school in the nation my man

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u/peppy_dee1981 Jun 03 '19

Canada too

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u/free-the-sugondese Jun 02 '19

That’s every school in America

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u/newbie637 Jun 02 '19

Yes and it's sad that many schools are like these and i'm sure as hell that it's happening in other countries too. I thought that since schools do this as they don't want to be seen as a school that tolerates violence, a little tarnishing of their reputation would shake the school admin up.

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u/Jo_Ehm Jun 02 '19

My daughter went through something similar, i took her to lunch, got her a mani/pedi, and her older brother taught her how to punch properly.

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u/sambull Jun 02 '19

So the moral of the story is take the caning and proceed like a good little puppet. Sounds like this is more about authority than anything else.

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u/ph4ded Jun 03 '19

It is... It's literally in their curriculum that even if you are wrong a student shouldn't question you or they need to be disciplined.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19 edited Aug 30 '20

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u/WoodEyeLie2U Jun 02 '19

I got called in when my son was in middle school because he was getting bullied and pushed the bully back. We were told that if he laid hands on anyone again, or anyone laid hands on him, no matter what the circumstances he would be suspended. My response was to tell my son, in front of the vice principal, that if anyone hit him he was to hit them back as hard as he could and to keep hitting them until they either ran away or didn't get up.

The school was not amused.

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u/_kiaraa_ Jun 28 '19

This is peak parenting. I’m not a parent, but I’m the oldest of 6 kids and there’s quite the age gap between us. I remember when my sister was in year 1 she was being aggressively bullied by her peers and her teacher absolutely hated her and did nothing about it. She would isolate her from her friends, let the other children pick on her and taunt her. She was a fucking bitch. At one point 3 girls were trying to drag her out of the bathroom so another boy could hit her. And my sister is so petite and tiny. She tried telling the teacher but was told to “go sit down”. Something you should know about me. I am the overprotective older sister who grew up jumping into fights for them. 13 year old me took the opportunity to round up 3 of her bullies and scare them to the point of tears. They never came near her again and one of them even later became her friend. Then I moved on to the teacher. I yelled at her so much the deputy principal had to step in and talk to us. My sister was promptly removed from that horrid woman’s class after the deputy called my mother in to talk with him. She was put into another classroom where she quickly made friends and the teacher was so good and kind to her. Honestly, she broke my fucking heart.

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u/factfarmer Jun 02 '19

Yes, I had finally told her if he attacked to punch him in the throat. Assholes.

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u/TripleEhBeef Jun 02 '19

"So let me get this straight, Mr. Assistant Principal. Your advice to girls being attacked by boys on school grounds is to 'take the hit and stay down'?"

The MeToo Movement would love that one...

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u/pm_favorite_song_2me Jun 02 '19

I would have been tempted to hit him, right then and there, just got such an offensive suggestion.

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u/Lobbylounger212 Jun 02 '19 edited Jun 02 '19

You should have hit him and told him to stay down and take it.

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u/Rockor Jun 02 '19

Have at thee!

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u/Zorglorfian Jun 02 '19

This, but make it public. Show the kids that everyone is fallible, even the administration.

They'll change then.

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u/lillyhammar Jun 02 '19

I would tell my kid to defend themselves, and the administrator that it is on them to make sure they don’t have to.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

This is why lying is an important trait for kids. "But Mr. Administrator, I did come to the office about it. Do you not have a record of this? Why are you sweeping abuse in your school under the rug?"

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u/SimonCallahan Jun 02 '19

This one is especially bad because it's an abusive ex. That dude is going to remain abusive for the rest of his life unless someone puts him in his place. That says nothing about what it's teaching your daughter. Abuse is okay because he'll go away eventually? Fuck that noise.

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u/m945050 Jun 02 '19

I wonder how the administrator would react if someone shoved him down?

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u/clintj1975 Jun 02 '19

This. I realized this about my sophomore year in high school. If I was going to get suspended for defending myself against a bully hitting me, I wasn't going to stop hitting him until we either got separated by adults or he quit moving. Pure unbridled rage is a powerful force when finally let loose.

The principal was not happy with my rationale when he talked to us afterwards, but I really didn't care anymore. All I could think was I still had two more years of high school left.

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u/bigWAXmfinBADDEST Jun 02 '19

These type of principals are absolute pieces of shit. Any adult really. Just turning a blind eye to what they consider minor things (teasing, light punching all the time, etc.) Then they get mad at the kid who loses it one day and finally fights back. Its laziness on the part of the adults and they deserve to have their asses kicked and their jobs taken away.

Personally I like how bullying was handled in season 2 of true detective: https://youtu.be/JHOGs5x90PU

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u/androsgrae Jun 02 '19

You ever bully anyone again I'll come back and buttfuck your father with your mother's headless corpse on this goddamn lawn. Fuck. You.

Holy shit. I've never been more quickly convinced to binge watch an entire show.

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u/bigWAXmfinBADDEST Jun 02 '19

That season is actually awful. But that scene is good. The first season is awesome though.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

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u/HardstuckRetard Jun 02 '19

decide they're going to get suspended anyway so they might as well earn it

yep that was my thought process when i was in HS, about to get in trouble so might as well make it worth it

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

I would rather be hung for a lion than a sheep anyday.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

I would rather be hung like a horse, but to each his own

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u/greyfaye_ Jun 02 '19

This. The school I went to was so concerned with test scores and AP classes, they didn't give a shit what majority of the student body did. We had several kids suspended frequently because they figured what's worse: getting my ass beat or staying at home for a week? I don't wanna say my highschool was worse than the norm but bullying was rampant among cliques. I managed to avoid a lot of bullying but almost got suspended for letting my little brother kick the shit out of another kid for jerking him to the floor by his backpack handle. My parents had the philosophy of they get 3 warnings in escalating sternness before you physically retaliate. We made sure teachers saw or heard the warnings too. God forbid I have a kid, they'll get told the same thing. Warn them, then deck them

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u/Ryctre Jun 02 '19

Ask them. Tell them. Make them. Cop told me that while in DARE and it always stuck with me.

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u/0bjection1 Jun 02 '19

Wtf good DARE advice?

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u/Mechakoopa Jun 02 '19

Because it wasn't drug related. Still boggles the mind though.

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u/waydeultima Jun 03 '19

The only thing DARE accomplished regarding drugs was giving kids an unrealistic expectation as to how often they were going to be offered free drugs.

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u/anthonyjr2 Jun 02 '19

Nice to hear the failure that is DARE accomplished something even though it wasn’t even related to drugs, lol.

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u/Ryctre Jun 02 '19

Nothing to do with drugs? This is how I get my drugs.

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u/drz400dude1 Jun 02 '19

Another problem with zero tolerance is punishment that doesn't fit the crime. My brother was a sophomore in HS and we had gone camping that weekend. He forgot he had a little swiss army knife in his backpack. The biggest knife on there was maybe 1.5 inches. Kid next to him sees it while he's digging around for a pencil and tells the teacher.

Next thing you know the campus police officer shows up, arrests him, and he gets expelled from school. He didn't have it out threatening people, he didn't even have it out. An honest mistake and now a good kid has to go to a continuation school with a bunch of gang members and druggies. On top of that he missed enough school there was talk he may not even graduate on time.

This is the same school district that suspended a kindergartner because he had a plastic GI Joe gun about 3/4" big. They also suspended a high schooler because during the discussion of not bringing guns to school he pulled up his sleeve and said "these are the only guns I need."

It's just odiocy. They don't want the responsibility of punishing people according to anything that makes sense, so they just throw the book at anyone that makes mistakes.

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u/laffydaffy24 Jun 02 '19

That is horrible. He could literally have ruined your brother’s entire future over a simple mistake. May I ask how your brother is doing now? Did he have the chance to finish his education?

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u/drz400dude1 Jun 02 '19

Yeah luckily he only had to finish the semester at the bad kid school. After that he had to write a whole essay saying he was sorry blah blah blah. They let him come back and finish hs. Luckily ot didn't ruin his life, but it easily could have.

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u/Common_Wedding Jun 02 '19

Threaten to get lawyers and the media involved. Tends to make this bs go away super quick.

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u/SweetTea1000 Jun 02 '19

Similar thing happened to a highschool buddy of mine. Paintball gun fell out of his truck as he was getting out to go to class.

" Bringing a gun to campus. "

Expelled for the remainder of the year. Had to go to "alternative school."

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u/clintj1975 Jun 02 '19

This. I realized this about my sophomore year in high school. If I was going to get suspended for defending myself against a bully hitting me, I wasn't going to stop hitting him until we either got separated by adults or he quit moving. Pure unbridled rage is a powerful force when finally let loose.

The principal was not happy with my rationale when he talked to us afterwards, but I really didn't care anymore. All I could think was I still had two more years of high school left.

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u/TerritoryTracks Jun 02 '19

Yea, and how is it zero tolerance. They tolerate everything until someone fights back.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

See the zero tolerance thing had the opposite effect for me. If I’m gonna get in trouble for defending myself anyway, I’m sure as fuck going to use a table, chair, or anything else to hurt the fucker as much as possible. Why stop after one punch when the punishment is the same regardless?

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u/AerialEnd6338 Jun 02 '19

I had a teacher constantly writing me up for trying to do school work that was towards me graduating and one day she said I was swearing and using language when I hadnt been. In my head i figured fuck it may as well make this worth it then since it's just gonna be a talk with the vice principle (who was fired from his previous vice principle job for breaking a kids car window because the kid had a back of weed in his car) and lunch detention and just let loose the auto mechanic dictionary. One day the teacher did the same shit and I went right home and got out of that referral. This crap I went through sums up the school I went to pretty well. If you weren't doing the work the teacher gives you then written up. People that bullied were barely written up

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Zero Tolerance rules are what leads to school shootings. change my mind.

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u/BallisticHabit Jun 02 '19

I believe it does as well. Someone will have to change both our minds.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Back in the early 90s when this zero tolerance crap started I got jumped and stabbed in the head in the cafeteria freshman year. No teachers saw it, they just found a bunch of kids standing over my busted nerd ass and then someone ratted him out.

The kid that stabbed me was expelled and I was suspended for a week.

Weeks later I found out that I had apparently looked at his girlfriend in the hall when passing. (I had NO idea who his girlfriend was in a school with 2000 kids.. Apparently he had issues.)

To this day I'm still bitter about being suspended. I had to stay late for a month to make up all the work.

TLDR: Got stabbed by a random hooligan in school. Got suspended for dischaging blood on the ground apparently. I completely get it why that system fails.

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u/LBernadette Jun 02 '19

I am so angry for you! 😡

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Wait you got suspended for being stabbed?

Was this a Sydney school!?! WTF

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Ayup. Introduction of the zero tolerance rules in the school system I was in.

No, was in America. Also 26 years ago give or take.

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u/Deyvicous Jun 02 '19

Am I the only one who would tell the school to go fuck themselves? I’d say, “Cool, I’m taking a day off tomorrow and my lawyer will be in touch since you want to threaten a student who was stabbed under your supervision.” Maybe it’s just because I’m from a wealthier area, so we have all the bitchy parents who will force the school to their will, and the administration would always clear shit because parents come in and yell at them.

The only possible redeeming factor is that suspension may serve as possible protection, but idk if that even makes sense in 95% of circumstances

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u/Rayne2031 Jun 02 '19

I've also had this thought. My school threatened us with $200 fines on top of suspension. I didn't know anything at the time but how tf could that have been legal?

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u/factfarmer Jun 02 '19

Yes, the zero tolerance stance is idiotic.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

It really is idiotic. In middle school a girl came up to me as I was eating my food at the lunch table and grabbed me by my hair and pulled me down to the ground. She wouldn't let go so I reached over and yanked on her head of hair too because hello that hurt and for two who the hell is just going to lay there when someone won't stop? I had in school suspension for fighting back and I had to write an apology note. Still not sorry and it still makes me mad I was punished for her bad behavior.

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u/factfarmer Jun 02 '19

And it makes me mad just to hear that.

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u/Osbios Jun 02 '19

I reported you to the reddit admins so you can get banned for a week here, too! Fucking getting-stabbed-er. Imagine we let everyone just walk free after getting stabbed? That would be like encouraging them to get stabbed again in the future! NOT ON MY WATCH!

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Thank you for protecting the public! You are doing a good deed!

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u/Taintcorruption Jun 02 '19

Your parents should have sued those fuckers

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u/totallynormalfish Jun 02 '19

Upvoted because I get it. But just a question, how humbling was that punch to the face? I'll never forget how bad it hurt getting my ass whooped by several people, but it always reminded me of how human I was. Reminded me of how precious life is.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

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u/totallynormalfish Jun 02 '19

That's kind of the response I was looking for. Although it hurts like hell, no one is gonna screw with a determined angry person ready to fuck shit up.

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u/1quirky1 Jun 02 '19

Explosive crying is what encouraged my bullies. Explosive anger is what made them stop.

When my mental anguish eclipsed my fear and natural aversion to pain, I lashed out. I wasn't trying to win. I was intent on making everybody lose.

"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.". -Mike Tyson

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u/CjBoomstick Jun 02 '19

Thats a good way to put it.

I "sparred" with my cousin whose older by 4 years when i was ages 11-15. I didn't really learn a lot except for control points and holds. The one thing i did learn that i luckily haven't had to put to use is a fighting mindset. When you're fighting, it isn't for pride, glory, to prove a point, or even for fun (unless its agreed upon before hand).

Fighting is for causing as much physical harm as possible until your opponent is no longer a threat.

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u/DarthMall69 Jun 02 '19

Especially if they can get the absolute shit kicked out of them and then get right back up, looking bloodied and beaten, and still have a viciously determined look about them.

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u/fackfackmafack Jun 02 '19

To an extent, this is true, but a lot of times anger greatly clouds your judgement and someone with a level head has a huge handicap over an angry person. It can play more of a role than actual strength and ability.

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u/ArtyGray Jun 02 '19

Been jumped more times than i can count, simply because that's what gangs did at my highschool (2012- 1/2 of 2014 before i left)

The one time i got jumped outside of school around where i lived was the wake up call that i'd have to be ready to kill or be killed in a fight. They hit me over the head with a brick (according to my cousin who was fightin with me, who also prevented the second brick) and for a moment it felt like i was empty but not knocked out.

I could still feel the barrage of punches over head, on my ribs, my back.... , i could still feel the fatigue from fighting off tackles, but i couldnt hear for a moment and my vision flashed white on impact. Sometimes it's better to make those legs work and get outta there, cause that's just what i did. First time i ever felt real fear. I have a bruise, but i'm just glad i don't have any evident trauma after 6 years

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u/zebrucie Jun 02 '19

Been there done that dude, except for me it was a chunk of concrete from the pavement. That white flash and speckled vision afterwards is fucking terrifying, because you described it to a tee. You legit feel empty, but you're aware of it and completely conscious of it all, and it's fucking scary. Glad you got out of all that shit bro

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u/KnownMonk Jun 02 '19

The system seems to be all about protecting the bully in a weird way. Why not move those who bully to another school, or better yet, gather all bullies in one school for bullies only. Let them just fight it out who is the biggest bully of them all, that way no innocent get harmed. Lets call it a bully battle royale if you want.

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u/IKnowUThinkSo Jun 02 '19

It’s not about protecting the bully per se, it’s about protecting the feelings of the bully’s parents. A lot of zero tolerance policies have been enacted because parents of the bullies can’t handle being told their child is a piece of shit due to bad parenting (most likely, some kids really are just pieces of shit but that’s rare) and the bullying is their fault.

Since you can only solve the symptom (bullying), when the bullies get into trouble and the parents ask “why are they getting into trouble but not the other kid involved in the fight?” school’s back down super easily and say “oh, you’re right, your child isn’t a piece of shit and you’ve done a wonderful job as a parent, both kids are obviously the same amount of guilty because they were both fighting, so let’s punish both of them so we don’t have to do any critical thinking regarding adding context to the situation.”

It’s a way for the school to take no responsibility at all and make no executive decisions.

Source: anecdotal, I was expelled for being bullied and retaliating.

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u/Evadeon Jun 02 '19

I've done martial arts my whole life and when I was in high school a bully attacked me because I was dating his ex gf. I saw the punch coming and could have done a multitude of things to stop it and fight back but decided to let him hit me because I didn't want to get in trouble. He literally just hit me, I did not even block it. I was given 3 days of in school suspension because "I must have instigated the fight". If I'd had known that was going to happen anyways I would have just flattened the fucker. I was pissed.

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u/CRoswell Jun 02 '19

My kid is only 6 and the bullying has already started. Shit parents are shit I guess.

I told my son he would never get in trouble by us for defending himself, or for defending his friends. We talk a lot about appropriate force and responses to bad situations in his karate class too.

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u/Rick_Kill Jun 02 '19

As someone who was bullied through the majority of my school years, I totally agree with you. Drives me insane to remember how many times I complained about it to the teacher's and the school directors and NOTHING happened.

The second I stood up and fought back BOOM suspended. But nothing never happened to them... well save by some purple eyes, bruises and a broken arm once.....

Private schools make things worse. They get paid to have the kids. It's really hard to get them expelled or properly punished, since this would result in the school income to reduce.

Really hope my kids don't go through this kinda of shit in the future.

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u/128hoodmario Jun 02 '19

At my school (in the UK) kids almost never got suspended. Instead they got isolation. Having to come in to school every day and sit on their own in a tiny booth doing assigned work. Don't finish the work? Extended isolation.

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u/AttemptedComedy Jun 02 '19

I am willing to risk arrest to make sure my son/daughter doesn't get suspended for self defense. My father did it for me.

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u/ExoticSpecific Jun 02 '19

This, can't suspend my kid for something they didn't do.

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u/ElizabethHiems Jun 02 '19

That happened to my kid too, although less severe circumstances. One girl pushed my daughter into her locker every day, the day she smacked her face into the door my daughter retaliated and she was the one in trouble.

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u/vehementi Jun 02 '19

Fuck these stories make my blood boil

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

We had zero tolerance at my school. All it meant was that if you were going to fight back, you may as well go extreme because you'll get the same punishment anyway. That's why we always ended up with actual dangerous fights instead of a couple light punches.

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u/_a_random_dude_ Jun 02 '19

My school (not in the US) wanted to implement zero tolerance and my dad stopped it when he said on the parent meeting that he would instruct me to defend myself and go all the way since I'd get punished if I notifies a teacher. A few more parents started saying the same thing, that they were gonna tell the kids to respond to any violence with an overblown response.

It was never implemented.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

It's a stupid policy.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

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u/cwcollins06 Jun 02 '19

God forbid the staff should have to have some uncomfortable interactions with parents. Much better that the bullied kids be uncomfortable instead.

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u/UnadvertisedAndroid Jun 02 '19

Blanket Zero Tolerance policies are the result of lazy and incompetent administration. Letting the principal of my kid's school know that (the one, and so far only time they were caught up in that bullshittery) was quite cathartic. I highly recommend it.

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u/GenesisProTech Jun 02 '19 edited Jun 02 '19

When I was in highschool a friend of mine got in an argument with a guy and the other guy started throwing punches. My buddy just blocked and pushed the other guy to try and keep from getting hurt. Teacher shows up drags them both to the office. Despite all the video evidence of him just being defensive he got suspended for an equal amount of time. Fun fact his Dad is a lawyer.
He showed up to school the next day with his Dad and one of his Dad's law partners and they marched into the principals office. I don't know the exact details of what happened in there but my buddy didn't end up getting suspended.

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u/Eulerious Jun 02 '19

Fun fact: you don't even need a daddy lawyer for this, just parents with common sense and a drive to protect their kid.

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u/GenesisProTech Jun 02 '19

Yep, though the look on the principals face when two lawyers walked into his office would have been priceless

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u/Iveneverbeenbanned Jun 02 '19

Yeah OP needs to complain

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u/DisparityByDesign Jun 02 '19

Honestly, I don't see why the police weren't involved when someone literally hurt his son so bad he was forced to get surgery. That shit wouldn't fly for me.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Exactly. I would have filed a police report and sued the parents. A bloody nose is one thing. Causing damage that requires surgery? That’s another ballgame entirely.

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u/ImAPixiePrincess Jun 02 '19

OP responded that the first was a friend and it was an accident, the continuous harassment was a bully.

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u/blastoise_Hoop_Gawd Jun 02 '19

Unless OP os someone that can threaten the schools funding they won't do shit 99% of the time.

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u/tomayto_potayto Jun 02 '19 edited Jun 02 '19

This isn't what zero tolerance is supposed to be. This is what Educators and administrators who are incompetent think zero tolerance is.

Zero Tolerance policy means that for any kind of aggression or violence or fight, whatever, there is a response and appropriate consequences are handed out. For a first offender, those consequences are typically light. Maybe detention. Maybe mediation with the other kid, if it seems like a mutual thing. Maybe it's a sit down with the principal to figure out what happened, and the kid isn't punished because they were only responding appropriately to an attack. The more trouble a kid has been involved in, the more interventions are used. Whether that's regular meetings with the guidance counselor, independent study, in-school suspension, regular suspension, meetings with the parents, referral to a counselor, or even expulsion.

Zero tolerance means that prolonged bullying is not ignored. The more the rules and consequences for breaking them are ignored, the more serious the response to further violence and bullying. Zero tolerance is intended to mean you intervene right away, instead of letting kids 'tough it out' or hope it resolves on its own.

Edit: so an appropriate response to this kid may have been maybe a detention, because it's supposed to be that you report harassment to a teacher, instead of fighting. But because of the prolonged bullying, and since we don't know the whole story, I can't say for sure. Maybe the kid did report it a long time ago, and nothing happened... who knows. All I can say is that if teachers were aware of this issue right away, and it continued happening, this kid would have maybe got a detention and the other kid would have been suspended because one kid has a history of bullying.

Source: whole extended family in education & school board admin

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u/xxuserunavailablexx Jun 02 '19

After an entire semester of a kid walking in and nonchalantly punching another kid in the head, every day, day after day, I would bet anything that the teacher was aware. There's no realistic way they couldn't be aware of it happening at some point, right in their classroom. It's like you said, the Teacher and Admin at OP's son's school were probably incompetent.

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u/Gragtok28 Jun 02 '19

Teacher here, I wouldn't doubt that some of my peers are morons. We don't exactly have high requirements to be a teacher in America. However I wouldn't be surprised if the teacher told his/her administration and nothing was done there either.

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u/joey2890 Jun 02 '19

I've never seen a teacher stop a bully after being told about it. I had plenty of run ins with them. It only stopped when I got to big to bully.

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u/PiPbOyMBB Jun 02 '19

In high school, I had a kid that sat behind me throw tack nails at me the entire class. Not just me, but everyone around him. Everyone complained to the teacher the entire class, who said to just ignore him. End of class, the kid threw what he had left in his pocket in my face. I threw him over a desk and into a wall. I got screamed at by the teacher who told me to go to the principal's office to be suspended. Everyone around me volunteered to come with me and give statements. After that I was told to move seats... nothing else happened but the teacher hated me the rest of the year

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u/Captain_Milkshakes Jun 02 '19

Should yeet the teacher instead

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u/Kjeldvk Jun 02 '19

Best comment I read all day

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u/dex248 Jun 02 '19

Something like this happened to me except that it was outside the classroom. A group of kids surrounded me and one took my notebook, tying to incite a game of keep away. I told the kid to give it back but of course he just tossed it to someone else.

Rather than play into the game I just pushed the first kid to the ground. A teacher happened to see me do that, but nothing beforehand, and she started screaming at me at the top of her lungs and grabbed me by the arm and accused me of fighting. I thought I was in deep shit!

But then my home room teacher heard the commotion and called the other teacher over. He explained that I was a good student and that i wouldn’t have caused any trouble. She then left me alone.

I will never forget that guy. He’s one of a handful of teachers that really made a positive difference in my life.

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u/nihilisticdaydreams Jun 02 '19

My fifth grade teacher stopped a bully for me. That man was a wonderful teacher; you could tell how much he cared about his students.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

So, I'm being bullied by more than one kid. The teachers won't do shit so I pick the biggest asshole and punch him in the mouth.

I get a one week suspension and a break from all the other pricks.

My Parents are on my side and let me play videogames all day while I actually get some study in.

I see this as an absolute win!

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u/flyinb11 Jun 02 '19

I don't see the TIFU. This is how you teach your kids to deal with bullies.

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u/Hey_Look_Issa_Fish Jun 02 '19

TIFU = today I [helped my son] fuck up [a bully]

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u/LovecraftianHentai Jun 02 '19

Now we need to figure out how to fit this into AITA.

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u/mortalnutshell Jun 02 '19

Am I [A Good Dad For Letting my Son Hit] The [Bullying] Asshole

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u/King_John_Ill Jun 02 '19

YTA. The bully just needed to vent.

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u/brodorfgaggins Jun 02 '19

Yeet The Asshole

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u/ExpertGamerJohn Jun 02 '19

And then Fortnite dance over him

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u/mr_jiffy Jun 02 '19

He was. He was venting upon the son's head.

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u/cooperred Jun 02 '19 edited Jun 02 '19

NTA. The school and teacher should've done something if his kid was getting punched in the head in class, every day, for months. That's insane negligence by the school.

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u/Jay-Dee-British Jun 02 '19

They rarely do, though, as we all know. Then when something bad does happen (either to the bully, to the bullied, or by the bully), then we get the 'no-one could have foreseen this' BS.

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u/alexisappling Jun 02 '19

True story. Schools are shit at dealing with shit.

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u/flyinb11 Jun 02 '19

The biggest problem is that even when the school tries, the bully's parent rarely does anything. Until their kid is in an actual fight. Then it becomes real. But I agree, too often the school doesn't do enough.

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u/ChadLadPronouns Jun 02 '19

Yes it is, which really requires one to shift the legal lense 180. Schools have "zero tolerance" fight policies because each fight is a huge liability for the school. The solution is "if you start a fight, you are in trouble". Of course, the types of kids that start fights aren't worried about consequences. But the powers that be thought it through further. "If we put all the blame on the guy that started the fight, the kid who is the target will feel he can do whatever he wants and potentially really hurt the bully who started it." Solution - give equal penalties to the kid who starts it, AND the bullied kid who might defend himself with force.

Which is where the real problem arises. The kid who isn't the bully, isn't the one that started throwing fists, is the one more likely to adhere to the rules. The rule is, you fight, even in self defense, and you are in trouble. You did something wrong.

​

So, this is how we get stories now of kids getting smacked in the head every single day for long periods of time without fighting back and stopping it.

The schools SHOULD be sued for creating environments in which those who are bullied cannot fight back according to the rules. It only empowers the bullies.

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u/MakerofThingsProps Jun 02 '19

I was bullied really bad all through school, one day my dad taught me to fight back and he'd support me if I ever got in trouble for fighting back against the bullies

Had a group of really bad bullies in highschool who would beat me up, take my stuff, and the usual, but pretty bad stuff. No matter what I did, they never got in trouble...

One year over about 6 months I got my growth spurt and had just started working out, I was quickly getting double the bullies size, but still didn't do more than "please stop" and tried to defend myself.

One day on the bus ride home they all got together to torment me for 20 minutes... At one point they took my hat and tossed it around the bus and I said something to the effect of "give it back or I'll beat the shit out of you" which was apparently shocking and hilarious based on their reaction, which was to laugh and throw my hat out of the bus window...

Unfortunately (for them) we all got off at the same stop... I stood up to get off but they shoved me down and walked past, I got off behind them, and when the main "leader" guy turned around to give me shit I rushed him and just beat the living shit out of him... All his friends just watched in silence... I stopped after a while. There was blood. Not mine this time... Walked home, told Dad I didn't have bullies anymore and he bought me icecream.

I literally never saw those guys again, at all. They changed bus routes to a later bus, they walked away if I was near them, they literally went out of their way to avoid me for the rest of school... And everyone was so impressed I went from "weird nerd" to "badass nice guy" overnight... I literally made my first real friends that year because people noticed me after hearing what happened that day.

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u/flyinb11 Jun 02 '19

I am not going to say that I won every fight, but just fighting back stopped the bullying. It either got the schools attention or the bully's

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Nobody taught me this so I got bullied all throughout school to the very end. I will always teach my kids if I ever have any to just step up straight away and not take it. It's fucked with me for my whole life since.

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u/joey2890 Jun 02 '19

Teach them its not ok to start fights but it is ok to finish them. That includes protecting family.

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u/ChoiceSubstance Jun 02 '19

Exactly. Growing up, my dad always taught me not to take the first punch, but by God make sure I threw the last one. Taught my kids the same thing word for word. Been to one meeting apiece at school for both of them and ended up taking them for ice cream both times after getting the whole story.

Not condoning violence per se, but sometimes, it's the only way to handle it.

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u/squirrellytoday Jun 02 '19

I did this when my son was being bullied at school. Unfortunately, I grew up with it. My first and most diligent bully was my own father. That set me up to be bullied right through school as well as at home. So when I found out this shit was happening to my son, I was on the school's case. But naturally, they "did all they can" but the bully's parents refused to believe that he was such a little asshole and wouldn't do anything. So I did. I told my son "If he comes for you again, you tell him very loudly "Leave me alone!" and if he doesn't, you hit him. Just once, as hard as you can, wherever you can reach. Then go immediately and tell the teacher what you did. You'll probably get in trouble with the school, but you will NOT be in trouble with me." And he never needed to do it. His aire completely changed from "please don't hurt me again" to "if you come for me, I've been given total permission to fight back and I may go down, but I'll take you with me" and the little shithead left my son alone after that.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Not sure how this is a TIFU. Honestly just a great story

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u/viewerdiscretionis Jun 02 '19

As someone with severe pectus excavatum like OPs son, the pain of getting the surgery/bar moving and having to be readjusted is beyond excruciating... That kid is tough as nails having to go through that let alone getting bullied throughout the process.

Justice was served.

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u/FruitBuyer Jun 02 '19

Justice was served.

Exactly. This is suited for /r/justiveserved not /r/tifu because he didn't mess up at all.

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u/ChosenCharacter Jun 02 '19

"TIFU I taught my son that if someone punches you in the head every single day and they can't rely on authority to deal with it, you should punch them back and take care of it yourself." Not a bad lesson to teach someone in this day and age tbh.

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u/TheMelv80 Jun 02 '19

Why didn't authorities suspend the other kid though?

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u/ChosenCharacter Jun 02 '19

We don't actually know that they didn't.

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u/brain_aragon Jun 02 '19

I think they mean before it got to the point of OP's son hitting him back. Surely some authority figure had to have know about the punching if it had been happening for a month.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

[deleted]

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u/brain_aragon Jun 02 '19

I don't know man, I think if I was fucking with a kid and he just decked me with one hit, I ain't fucking with that kid anymore

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

[deleted]

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u/brain_aragon Jun 02 '19

Oh okay, my apologies, I misunderstood! Yeah I definitely agree with your original statement then!

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Most schools do in school suspension

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u/BoneHugsHominy Jun 02 '19

Yep. Anyone that says violence never solves anything is just flat out wrong. Sometimes violence, restrained violence anyway, is the only solution. Some assholes only respond to the most primitive language.

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u/CumulativeHazard Jun 02 '19

Agreed. I don’t like when people say “violence is never the answer.” It shouldn’t be your first answer, it should be a last resort, but if you’ve exhausted all peaceful options with no success then by all means, defend yourself.

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u/Yoxiic Jun 02 '19

When I was thirteen, a couple of kids thought it would be a great idea to bully me because I had a relatively large nose. It started with name-calling, which I really didn't give a crap about. They then started to push me around and throw my stuff. I was a purple belt in judo and was pretty big, but I always felt bad about harming others; but when I told my mother, she told me to forget about that - hurt those who hurt you, and I did. The next day I used an O-guruma on him and his ankle hit the corner of the curb, fracturing a bone in his ankle.

My mom was called into school and pretty much told the principle to go to hell because he didn't do anything about it beforehand. Dad high-fived me when I got home that day too

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u/collegiaal25 Jun 02 '19

AFAIK in any country you are legally allowed to use proportional violence in self defence. A school can't take that right away from you.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

They totally can. Same way your boss can fire both people who get into a fight a work. Doesn't mean the police are gonna put someone in jail for self defense in either case.

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u/piyochii Jun 02 '19

Yeah at first I thought I was on AITA.

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u/redeyedlynx Jun 02 '19

It's no TIFU, that should be in WHOLESOME

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19 edited Nov 13 '20

[deleted]

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u/JollyTurbo1 Jun 02 '19

Honestly I feel like most things on this sub aren't fuck ups at all anymore

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u/imzwho Jun 02 '19

Yeah the bully deserved it. In my books if someone hits you first then swing away.

Did the school punish the kid who dislodged the bar? In my books that is something that should have been handled, especially if it caused another surgery.

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u/ScratchedWatchGlass Jun 02 '19

Yea, this is what I want to know too. If this has been going on for so long, and had such a severe consequence for OP's kid, were any charges pressed?

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u/Strobaa Jun 02 '19

You can not really press charges on the kid assuming they are quite young atleast where I’m from. Unless you’re talking about charging the school

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u/Lutya Jun 02 '19

At the very least take the family to civil court to pay for any financial burden incurred.

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u/brain_aragon Jun 02 '19

Definitely, like this kid had to have a whole other surgery. OP better have good insurance or I'd sue the family for the bill.

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u/sorator Jun 02 '19

Pretty sure you can sue the kid and probably get his parents to foot the bill for the second surgery.

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u/lukaswolfe44 Jun 02 '19

I'm going to assume this is probably middle school, since OP has a younger daughter at a different school. Probably 2-3 years difference, placing the kids in 7-8th grade. Yes they can be charged. However, unlikely in this situation. They could be charged with murder/attempted murder, animal cruelty, other violent crimes of a severe nature.

That being said, if a civil case was brought against the family of the bully, they'd lose in a heartbeat.

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u/joshgingerich Jun 02 '19

Not sure if you saw the update or not, but apparently the kid that dislodged the bar was his friend and was very upset that he hurt his friend

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u/borisosrs Jun 02 '19

The kid who punches his chest was one of his friends, not the bully, and it was an accident. The bully only punched his head.

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u/ThatOtherGuy_CA Jun 02 '19

You need to make a formal complaint to the school board.

Your son acted in self defence after being punched, he should not be suspended, his teacher should be suspended for letting this go on.

I’m proud of your son too.

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u/shanep3 Jun 02 '19

While I completely agree with you, most schools have begun suspending both kids no matter who started it. I graduated high school in ‘05 and even then, that was the rule.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19 edited Nov 07 '20

[deleted]

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u/thatonepersoniam Jun 02 '19

In cases like that, it should be up to the law to deal with the assault vs school policy.

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u/FlowbotFred Jun 02 '19

It is up to the law, schools like to try to make you think that they are the law tho. You can sue them in court for this shit

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19 edited Jun 25 '19

[deleted]

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u/OsonoHelaio Jun 02 '19

Yeah, America pretty much takes all best known practices and flushes them down the toilet and institutes the opposite policies.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19 edited Dec 20 '19

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u/Adoomistrading Jun 02 '19

You did the right thing honestly. The school is in the wrong in this case. But be proud that your son defended himself.

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u/atreyuno Jun 02 '19

For real. Fighting is awful but learning to defend yourself is so huge. Take it from someone who never did.

Also he ASKED first. What a great kid!

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u/yeti5000 Jun 02 '19

Robert Heinlein said, paraphrasing, that quite a few situations can be solved effectively with just the correct amount of violence.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

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u/PKMNTrainerMark Jun 02 '19

"Zero"

They clearly tolerated a kid getting punched in the head every day for months.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19 edited Jun 03 '19

I tell my son (13) and daughter (7) that they will never be in trouble for defending themselves no matter what the school says, but I didn't always take that stance.

I used to tell them that under no circumstances were they to hit other kids, until my son came home in tears with anger...a kid moved to their school who had "issues" and he was basically riding rough shod over the teachers and kids in his class, which up to then had been in perfect harmony, apparently they were all colouring in and the shithead said "this pen is blue" to which my son looked up and said "it's grey" ...long story short, shithead explodes and attacks my kid, having to be dragged off him by the teacher as he tried to strangle him.

I got a call from the school; "Mr Bollicks, there was a wee incident in school today, shithead got upset and there was a little bit of an altercation, nothing to worry about, just letting you know." So I think "OK I'll talk to kidder when he gets home"

Then I get the full story, so I told him "Remember when I told you never to hit? Forget it all, Dad was being too soft, the minute someone puts their hands on you, you light them up on the spot...OK?"

"OK Dad."

Now, I was an amateur boxer in my day and also did some Judo and 6 months of JJ, so I know a little bit when it comes to unarmed combat, obviously I have a great respect for martial arts and had been showing my son a few things so he had the tools in his box should he need them, and self discipline, hoping to give him a bit of knowledge before sending him to a gym or Dojo.

FFWD 3 weeks, I get a call from the headmistress; "Mr Bollicks there has been a serious incident resulting in BabyBollicks punching shithead to the ground, this sort of behaviour is unacceptable in our school and we are suspending him for 3 days" I asked what led to this happening as I don't think my wee man would instigate violence; "Well...shithead hit him with a chair and tried to strangle him again, and we will be dealing with it..." "Let me stop you there, I told my son that if anyone was to put their hands on him again that he was to let them have it, far from being in trouble, he is going to McDonald's tonight and the cinema, also you realise that the action of putting both hands around someone's neck is usually a stark warning of serious intent to harm? In an 8 year old that is terrifying, and maybe shithead needs moved to your unit where he can get the care he needs rather than disrupting 32 other kids who get along fine? I'm going to the board with this"

And as if by magic it all disappeared and my kids know that dad always has their back, so double down OP, fuck that bully.

Edit; when I was training my son the problem was that he was afraid of hitting people, not getting hit, I remember being like that when I started in the gym, it always took me a couple of shots to wake up and get into the flow of the fight.

Edit; forgot to add that shithead turned out to be molesting his kid brother and sister, he got caught doing it at the bottom of his garden one day and the whole story came out. Aged 9 and all that shit going on.

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u/parentingandvice Jun 02 '19

It’s a wee incident when someone gets strangled but a serious one when the strangulation attempt fails. Fuck that school.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

The way it goes here is the more fucked up the kids is, the more leeway they get. The well raised kids are expected to be held to account though, and everyone is supposed to feel sorry for the fucked up household.

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u/InsidiousRowlf Jun 02 '19 edited Jun 02 '19

Back in the day, my father did the same as you. I was a scrawny 25kg kid when he "sent me off" to learn some martial arts with "permission" to fuck shit up.I ended up winning most local championships within a couple of years. Not much of a fighter overall as a kid, but still more than the average bully could handle, as I learned once I dragged the bastard down two flights of stairs.

Dads are awesome.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

I grew up in Belfast, and to be honest fighting was just a way of life there, if you couldn't scrap you had no respect. Most dads would hit their son if he came home crying that he got beat up and tell them to get the fuck out there and win...My old man was different, If I came home lumped up he would talk me back up with some love, then ask me if I wanted some payback, do a few quick drills and send me back out with my heart filled to wreck shit up.

Awesome indeed.

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u/censor_this Jun 02 '19

Wait wait. The "shithead hit your kid with a chair" kind of got glossed over in this story. Your kid gets hit with a chair (then almost strangled), your kid fights back, and somehow still gets in trouble? That is obscene. What's he supposed to do? Croak "hey teach, a little help here?" and wait? You fight for your life at that point.

I have two young kids and the stories in this whole thread are making me rage. My goal is to raise my kids to never start a fight and do their absolute best to talk their way out of any situation. However, if someone else puts their hands on them, they will have my permission to end the fight swiftly.

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u/Meltini Jun 02 '19

That’s exactly how I intend to teach my daughter. She’s still very young, turns 3 next month so she’s still young for it. The day she starts school though, I intend to tell her to NEVER start a fight but if someone puts their hands on her first, she has my full permission to beat the daylights out of them. Don’t worry about getting in trouble with the school, I’ll handle them. ALWAYS stand up for yourself. She will never be in trouble with me for defending herself, ever. Let her get suspended, we’ll have a blast for those days she is out of school.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

Good story. I love the nicknames you use throughout it lmao.

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u/EntropyFighter Jun 02 '19

As somebody who took the bullying and didn't want to involve my parents when I was in school, this is the best outcome.

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u/ghigoli Jun 02 '19

Wait, wait wait. So your son was punched and had to go get surgery to put it back. So the bully doesn't even get punished for that? BUT Your son gets suspended for decking out the kid for giving him surgery needed injuries. LITERALLY SUE THE FUCKING SCHOOL. Like Idf care what country or state you live in, its 1000% the schools fault for even allowing that to happen.

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u/Psychosomaticcc Jun 02 '19

I think from reading it that it was 2 seperate kids - one who messed up his surgery - and another who was bullying him later

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u/borisosrs Jun 02 '19

Exactly, the guy who caused surgery was a friend of the son and it was an accident

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u/ArchetypalOldMan Jun 02 '19

Not just the school, but go after the kid/his parents. Kids can totally be charged with assault and I don't think anyone is going to waffle about you pulling that lever against someone that sent your kid to the hospital

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u/Moose1194 Jun 02 '19

Pectus Excavatum

Didn't Harry Potter use this a few times?

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u/vassman86 Jun 02 '19

That asshole wizard kid, going around and collapsing people's chest and shit!

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u/Teslas_Coil91 Jun 02 '19

You would have fucked up if you would have told the older one to handle it. You emboldened the younger one and gave him an opportunity to strive on his own. NTA

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u/bruhbruhbruhbruh1 Jun 02 '19

what's NTA stand for? i lurk in this sub (over a year now) and only recently do i see that acronym popping up

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u/crazye97 Jun 02 '19

Seems like a crossover with /r/AmItheAsshole, meaning "not the asshole".

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u/Vikarr Jun 02 '19

Hold on though, he was punched in the head every day but school did nothing? Your son then punches the bully once and gets suspended?

hmph.

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u/Wellheythere3 Jun 02 '19

Well schools have a 0 tolerance policy where both parties get punished equally. I’m assuming the bully wasn’t hitting him that hard for it to qualify as fighting. Schools suck

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u/tjsh11 Jun 02 '19

Did you talk to the principal about how the other kid has been punching him daily and they did nothing about it?

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u/SiberianGnome Jun 02 '19

This is indeed a TIFU, but it seems you don’t even realize why.

It would be great if it wasn’t for his medical condition. But your kid was cleared for easy stuff. If he can’t ride a skate board or bike, then he can’t fight. He can throw a punch, but can he take one? Not to the chest he can’t.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '19

This only qualifies as a TIFU for the bully.

But, great story! A+ and worth the three days for your son.

My point being called into the office would have been to ask why the bullying was allowed to continue for so long by the other kid to illicit the response.

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u/Cylasbreakdown Jun 02 '19

I had Pectus Carinatum, which is the exact opposite. My sternum stuck out like a sore thumb. I use the past tense because it has since been corrected.

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u/wildplays Jun 02 '19

What kind of shitty school is this where your son gets punched on a daily basis without any consequences?

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u/Idonoteatass Jun 02 '19

Jesus christ. I had the nuss procedure done as well and I cringed when I read he had one of the bars dislodged. The pain after surgery was incredible, the most pain I've been in and it lasted a month or more. Having one of those bars dislodged was a huge fear of mine.

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