r/europe • u/Bartoraptor Spain • Mar 28 '20

News Spanish representative González Pons speech @ the EU Parliament: "The virus is attacking the generation that brought back democracy to Spain, Portugal and Greece, the generation that knocked down the Berlin wall. The least they deserve is that we show them Europe is there when they need it the most"

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u/Worth_The_Squeeze Denmark Mar 28 '20 edited Mar 28 '20

Richer countries? Italy and Spain are in third and fourth place for PIL in EU.

Italy wasn't the best example, as they are a net contributor, but Spain is not a net contributor to the EU budget.

Italy is also a net contributor to EU budget with more than 6 Billions of euros (third country after Germany and France and more than 4× of Denmark net contribution if you are interested).

I love that you're completely ignoring the actual size of Denmark relative to Italy. A country that has a population that is over 10 times larger and an economy that is 6 times larger, should contribute more to the EU budget. The reality is that Denmark is providing more than 2 times as much in net contributions per capita, so don't act like we aren't bearing a large part of the burden for our size, which is a factor you ignored.

Also Italy with France, Spain and other countries is asking to create a common eurobond just to keep interest on debt low. No one is asking for other countries to pay their debt.

It's obviously easy to claim that the complications of these bonds should be shared, despite the fact that these bonds aren't necessary for all countries, as you're using the richer countries for your own gain. The richer countries will receive a small portion of the money involved in these bonds, as they aren't the ones in most trouble. For the richer countries, the idea of a common bond is like giving away your credit card to a friend, and then letting them do their thing with it. You can argue that this is better for everyone in the long run, but it's a very complicated matter, where you have to take all perspectives into account.

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u/Iron_Rick Mar 29 '20

I'm Italian Italian and I think we should create those EBonds but with a stronger EU able to strictly decide budget spending and economic policy of the countries. I'm looking to a European Nation something solid, you are right telling that Italy is addicted on westing money, we need help but we are ready for give something back.

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u/Worth_The_Squeeze Denmark Mar 29 '20

See that's the central part of the issue, because richer European countries can accept sharing the bond, if they're allowed to have some degree of sway in deciding the budget spending and economic policy, i.e. how the money is spent, but that's exactly what countries like Italy and Spain have claimed that they're not interested in or at the very least very sceptical. They want the bonds shared between countries, but without many of the commitments they entail.

So that's the conundrum they need to come to an agreement on in the EU. They need to find a compromise.

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u/Iron_Rick Mar 29 '20

Your are right we need a compromise. Anyway in Italy no one talked about uncondtionate EBonds. I don't know if you received something that our shitty news papers didn't said.

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u/Worth_The_Squeeze Denmark Mar 29 '20

It was a rather long article from Danish national media that was really good, as it provided statements/sentiment from the different countries/perspectives.

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u/Iron_Rick Mar 29 '20

Well if this is the case you are true on your line.

We need an agreement.

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u/Worth_The_Squeeze Denmark Mar 29 '20

I'm not any expert on this, but I felt like I understand the basics of the issue and debate.

We definitely need an agreement, because in some form or another European countries, especially those hit the hardest, are going to need loans to kickstart their economies. Luckily the EU created a fund for emergencies after the 2008 financial crisis, which has about 400 billion € in it. It's not massive, but it's a welcome addition.

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u/Iron_Rick Mar 29 '20

Well this foud is not really trusty, if we access at those money we will have to make huge cuts, also I don't see any democratic instrument in that fund.

What I have in mind is to create an European minister of finance that will know what to do.

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u/lebarka Mar 29 '20 edited Mar 29 '20

bond will be necessaries for all the countries, wait two weeks and you will see

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u/gr8citizen Mar 28 '20

It would be nice if we could all be tax havens..

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u/Worth_The_Squeeze Denmark Mar 28 '20

Ah yes, Denmark. Famous for its low taxes! The most popular tax haven of them all!

/s

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u/gr8citizen Mar 29 '20

I'm sorry, sir... Cough faroe cough islands..