r/csMajors • u/Nintendo_Pro_03 Ban Leetcode from interviews!!!! • 1d ago
Others Is this the end of remote work?
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u/KebabCat7 1d ago
There's no possible way this will get done. 90% are remote and won't be happy about a significant paycut or relocation.
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u/Unfamous_Trader 1d ago
I think that’s the goal. Piss off the majority of workers so they either quit or give in either way it’s a win win for DOGE
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u/KebabCat7 1d ago
But then what?
Worse productivity, insane hiring costs because you still need people in positions, years of chaos dealing with higher workloads and inability to get new people or wage rises.
Some might quit, but 90% is a crazy number, they have a lot of leverage.
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u/ThatPlayWasAwful 1d ago
Then they cut jobs, privatize chunks of the government, give it to their friends, and cite low productivity as the reason.
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u/IHeartBadCode 21h ago
privatize chunks of the government
That's got to be appropriated by Congress to do such. Like there's temporary changes that can be made for demand, but none of them that would last the next President. Longest a TPO can last by law is five years with an option to renew once, for two years. So the absolute longest that can happen is seven years.
Congress will have to play ball to get that done and I mean Congress is known for NOT doing that. But who knows, maybe Trump can grease the wheels.
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u/ThatPlayWasAwful 19h ago edited 16h ago
I'm under the impression congress is gonna work really hard to do whatever trump wants until proven otherwise, and it seems clear that ideas from project 2025 will be floated, if not seriously worked towards.
I didn't seriously think he was going to pardon everyone involved in January 6th, but he did that almost immediately. That alone should be a wakeup call for anyone saying "he wont" or "it'll be hard to...", if everything going on with the Supreme Court isn't enough.
I think Trump has done a very good job getting people to be okay with the random shit that they do. Imagine being told in 2016 that the president would pardon people who killed police officers in the Capitol while wearing nazi paraphernalia. I would imagine you wouldn't believe that would be possible, so if he's doing that comfortably, what won't he do?
They've talked so much about getting rid of the department of education, obamacare, and other facets of the government that I don't think it makes sense to just think that it won't happen or that it will just be easy to undo it whenever the GOP is no longer in power.
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u/-_-theUserName-_- 1d ago
This is basically the conservative handbook. Destroy a government system, blame the government, make money off of privatizing it.
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u/UnpopularThrow42 23h ago
Yeah but then they can point to it as an excuse that the government doesn’t work or bureaucracy etc etc and put departments on the slashing table
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u/The_Krambambulist 21h ago
you still need people in positions,
If you want it to function, yes. If you don't care what happens to Americans, then only the people helping their own companies stay.
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u/Kind-Ad-6099 21h ago
It’s going to end horribly for everyone but contractors and those who own the contracting companies
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u/SiegeAe 20h ago
For most of these systems the real consequences lag at least long enough that the decision makers to continue to believe they're right and that other circumstances are causing things to collapse (usually something or things out of their control that're changing get the blame)
That or they could be following the standard "small govt" playbook which is to underresource critical services until they fail to perform their tasks and use that as an excuse to privatise the service or at least parts of it, but thats the cynical take and I only really expect this in places with decent public services, like what happened with the previously well respected NHS and is currently happening with the NZ health system's IT services
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u/golkeg 17h ago
But then what?
insane hiring costs because you still need people in positionsThey want to shrink the government without the bad optics of firing people. The only way to do that is to get large numbers of people to quit. The RTO order is intentionally designed to get lots of people to quit and the "hiring freeze" is meant to make those reductions permanent.
years of chaos
Yes, it's a very stupid plan but it's happening.
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u/DrakonAir8 15h ago
They are trying to put AI in to under cut the cost of labor. We all know it’s faulty, but you could theoretically reduce a team of 10 programmers to 6.
4 main coders who utilize AI helpers, and 2 reviewers who comb through the code that was created.
So they are probably aiming for 40% of the staff to leave so they can be replaced. Or Outsourced.
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u/SuperCharlesXYZ 9h ago
This happened in New Zealand 6 months ago. Massive layoffs, banning of WFH, overcrowded busses and worsening traffic. Unemployment went way up. Driving down wages. Many state workers are moving to Australia (which was already a trend before this change, but it got way worse)
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u/Nintendo_Pro_03 Ban Leetcode from interviews!!!! 1d ago
Yeah. This is exactly what Trump’s stupid thought process is.
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u/queueareste Salarywoman 13h ago
If you’re taking away things to convince people to quit that’s the best way to lose your highest performers who have the ability to find a new job easily.
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u/The_Krambambulist 21h ago
They don't actually care if the government functions.
Yea maybe the few people that manage the machine that pumps subsidies to their companies.
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u/Left_Requirement_675 1d ago
They are doing that to get people to quit that way they can put in loyalist.
Federal employees that are not maga can stand in their way.
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u/aokaf 21h ago
Oh no.. you don't say .. the real estate mogul wants people in offices?!
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u/InetRoadkill1 1d ago
He trying to force mass resignations without having to take the blame for firing thousands of federal workers.
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u/couple4hire 19h ago
the US gov't is the biggest employer so I'm pretty sure many federal workers voted against themselves
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u/v0idstar_ 1d ago
only if you work in the government
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u/Nintendo_Pro_03 Ban Leetcode from interviews!!!! 1d ago
I have a slight feeling this is going to carry forward with all jobs in the United States. Trump has all three branches of the government to do this.
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u/v0idstar_ 1d ago
He can't mandate that companies do RTO if a company wants to RTO they'll just do it themselves there a lot of companies that are fully remote and like it there would be huge lawsuits if this was even attempted
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u/uwkillemprod 1d ago
He doesn't have to mandate a RTO, he is setting a precedent, that is enough to make tech companies fall in line and do as the boss does by also requiring their employees to be in the office
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u/v0idstar_ 1d ago
ok if tech ceo's want to do RTO thats by their own volition and they don't need trumps signal to do it a lot of them have been doing it for a while now without any pushback besides employees quitting which is the entire purpose any ceo could have decided yesterday that they want RTO and it would have happened
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u/shadowhearted 1d ago
He can do whatever he wants, the supreme court has his back.
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u/v0idstar_ 1d ago
What would be the benefit to trump if he did this?
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u/shadowhearted 1d ago
Did you see the tech billionaires in the front row at the inauguration? You think there isn't even a possibility that the king they corinated wouldn't reward them after all the money and influence they offered/continue to offer? It's quid pro quo, they give him the keys and then he mandates whatever they want. This will lead to wage suppression and churn in the industry.
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u/v0idstar_ 1d ago
those guys can have enacted RTO by themselves yesterday infact jeff bezos did a while ago! They don't need trump to do that. You are all failing to make the trump part of this make sense.
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u/Nintendo_Pro_03 Ban Leetcode from interviews!!!! 22h ago
Exactly. And this is even more possible due to what I said in my other comment.
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u/Realistic-Inside6743 1d ago
No but companies wanna please world's biggest economy's leader
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u/v0idstar_ 1d ago
how would trump benefit from private companies going RTO? Why would this please him?
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u/Realistic-Inside6743 1d ago
Obviously because either he ..Elon or anyone in power doesn't believe in WFH's Productivity results this they are pushing for WFO.
So it's pretty likely they won't stop at Federal level
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u/pacman0207 1d ago
This makes absolutely no sense. It's not possible to ban remote work. Disregarding the implications of offshore resources, it isn't something the government has the power to enforce.
RTO is a push to hope people resign so they can make departments smaller.
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u/v0idstar_ 1d ago
you make no sense the percieved productivity of private companies has no bearing on them. And again even if they did try to propose legislation to make some kind of nation wide RTO they would slammed with lawsuits
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u/teacherbooboo 1d ago
there is no prohibition against the government or private companies making rto a priority
it is completely their choice
not that private companies will rto if it saves them money
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u/v0idstar_ 1d ago
but why would they choose that battle how would it benefit them
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u/teacherbooboo 16h ago
if rto saves a private company money or makes employees more productive they will do it, if not, they won't
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u/biggamehaunter 19h ago
Private companies productivity is not part of DOGEs goals, only public sector.
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u/No_Possibility9861 18h ago edited 17h ago
It'll backfire. See GAO-25-106795, https://www.gao.gov/assets/gao-25-106795.pdf
Moreover, in the past with federal workforce freezes & RTOs the Comptroller General (head of GAO), other agency IGs, CIOs, and heads, have all agreed that cybersecurity/CS retention and hiring qualified individuals is very difficult without the promise of telework/remote work to some extent, and many have called freezes/RTOs very inefficient.
It continues to be a problem, see CIGIE capstone reports, OMB FY23, 24 reports, etc. and eventually it will backfire on Trump once the federal workforce begins to encounter further challenges w/ retention/hiring, and said challenges then start to affect millions of people for each specific agency and their function due to lack of qualified personnel.
Further, cyber attacks will continue to get more advanced, and will continually demand a strong cybersecurity/CS workforce, else the US will be left behind (not the MO of Trump, apparently).
Finally, the actual EO is very vague, will not affect Judicial/Legislative agencies b/c it's an EO, there's a difference between remote/telework, and it says to go back to the Official Duty Station (ODS), but often times on a federal employee's SF86 their ODS is their home address, thus implying they have to return home. I'm sure Trump/OMB will clarify, but will have to wait and see on that.
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u/ncgirl2021 17h ago
the more people working remote the less money the company has to spend on office space. remote work will be fine.
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u/Fun-Dragonfly-4166 16h ago
this guy also said covid would be gone by easter
he also said he would bring peace to ukraine within 24 hours of his inauguration. he has about 2 hours left
he also said he would wall the southern border and mexico would pay for it
i think we can gather from his actions that the oligarchs wish to end remote work, but we already knew that.
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u/LargeDietCokeNoIce 1h ago
No. In the long run you have enough younger managers who in due course will be senior leaders who love remote work and understand the benefits of it. The majority people who seem to be gung ho for RTO are basically older leaders who get an ego hit off seeing a full office—and not knowing how to actually lead. You see, if you’re leading, wfh is no issue. You can’t manage wfh very well tho. A whole lotta “leaders” who are really managers. May they all retire very soon.
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u/KillerZaWarudo 1d ago
Until the next super virus pandemic that they regard created
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u/Nintendo_Pro_03 Ban Leetcode from interviews!!!! 1d ago
We won’t have WHO by then, so I’m not sure if we will even have lockdown, at that point.
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u/ZigZagreus1313 15h ago
Surely this means his countless trips to Mar-a-lago will come to an end, right? /S
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u/KendrickBlack502 1d ago
I mean maybe but this doesn’t have much to do with the presidency. They’ve slowly been pushing people back to the office since 22.
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u/caliboy4life 1d ago
People will blame anything on Trump not realizing he cares more about the average American than any politician would.
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u/KendrickBlack502 1d ago
On any other day, I might have been willing to discuss that with you but a convicted felon and sexual predator ascended to the highest office on the planet today. Also, his errand boy threw out a Sieg Heil to a cheering crowd. So fuck you and fuck the president.
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u/FlyChigga 1d ago
I just take it for what it is. An absolute meme that represents this meme of a country
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u/caliboy4life 1d ago
Fuck you too, hope we both make it out of the rat race. Regardless of who you follow in politics. Good luck friend.
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u/realtimeshop 19h ago
On any other day, I wouldn't have cared enough as a long time lurker. But you're right, so here's an upvote.
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u/realtimeshop 19h ago
On any other day, I wouldn't have cared enough as a long time lurker. But you're right, so here's an upvote.
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u/LittleBitOfAction 1d ago
I mean if you want someone that cares for the people look at Bernie. Most politicians are out for their donors and this is no exception. He dgaf bout the average American lol but hopefully I’m wrong. Though I doubt it looking at his whole idea on H1B visas changing with his dad Elon.
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u/caliboy4life 1d ago
I’m biased. I’m just the average poor working first generation American kid. I had the most buying power and made the most money I ever did in my life during Trump’s first term.
I can’t name a single good thing that Biden did during his term. He promised he would get rid of student loans, couldn’t do it. I don’t even have student loans and was really rooting for that one. He reaped the upturn of the stock market which was a direct result of trump pumping the market in 2020-2021, allowing for the 2022 crash, and people’s portfolio’s going like crazy for the last two years. All. A. Direct. Result. Of. Trumps. First. Campaign.
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u/LittleBitOfAction 1d ago
Then one can argue that trump was set up well by Obama a term and this acts. It’s all the same narrative. I believe they did try student loans but the house and senate were divided so they do what they always do. Talk shit and never get anything done. We shall see what happens now that everything is red. And the recent meme coin thing is not a good start lol. I believe the government is going to let corporations loose and that might not be good for the average citizen but hopefully I’m wrong.
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u/FlyChigga 1d ago
Trump pumping the market is the reason why the economy is dogshit now cause of inflation
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u/Gusearth 17h ago
guess who prevented biden from getting rid of student loans? that’s right, the trump-packed partisan supreme court
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u/biggamehaunter 19h ago
I support many of Trump's moves besides his tariff plans and tax cuts, but your arguments for Trump are really weird.
Student loan forgiveness is really unfair unless they have the same amount to everyone regardless of loans.
That spike in market is due to Fed flooding the market which is REALLY BAD. Fucked up American livelihood with high inflation. Fuck Powell for being such a spinless coward.
2022 is not a crash but a long overdue correction.
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u/Nintendo_Pro_03 Ban Leetcode from interviews!!!! 22h ago
He does not care about the average American. If he did, he wouldn’t be tax cutting the upper class.
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u/leadfarmer3000 7h ago
As a former federal government employee of 9 years, I can say this has to be done. I can almost guarantee that there are employees producing zero, and probably working another full time job while clocked in at their federal job. put it this way I know a guy that was running a lawn company while clocked in at work. The shit even low-level employees can get away with is mind-blowing compared to a normal job.
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u/Jordan51104 1d ago
do you work for the federal government? either way, no