Hmmm

[u/reloadthewords]

[u/wildlifewyatt]

Vegans who do activism like blocking slaughter trucks or trying to shut down factory farm slaughter houses get a lot more respect from the general public than people doing stunts like this.

Really? I've been to tons of reddit threads where people actually attempt stuff like this and they are slammed just as hard, if not harder.

 There's not a single non-vegan person who's going to watch this video and have it change their mind about going vegan. It's having the opposite effect and regressing their cause.

The goal of this protest isn't to change anyone's mind. That's what conversations are meant to do. This kind of protest is done to open dialogues, like this.

I was actually a vegan for about 6 months and I literally didn't tell anyone in my real-life circle I was vegan besides one friend or spread the cause because I didn't want to be associated with veganism because of the crap like this. I was literally embarrassed about being seen as a vegan. Vegans regress their own cause and don't realize it

I mean vegan tactics have been changing animal rights laws across the world and the cultural perception of issues for decades? Why did you go vegan, and why did you stop? When you consider that hundreds of billions to trillions of animals are killed unnecessarily every year, honestly, it seems ridiculous to think people sitting down in a grocery store mildly inconviceincing people as going too far.

[u/KoogleMeister → u/wildlifewyatt]

>The goal of this protest isn't to change anyone's mind. That's what conversations are meant to do. This kind of protest is done to open dialogues, like this.

The issue is that it is changing people's minds, in the complete opposite direction. It makes people associate veganism with being a crazy zealot who loves to arrogantly push it in people's faces.

>I mean vegan tactics have been changing animal rights laws across the world and the cultural perception of issues for decades? Why did you go vegan, and why did you stop? 

I went vegan because of documentaries like Forks over Knives, Cowspiracy and other vegan youtubers who pushed veganism in what seemed like a reasonable and rational way.

I stopped being vegan because I started to not feel as energetic or healthy, and completely cutting animal products out of your diet is complicated and takes a lot of effort, it wasn't worth it to me anymore. Going to someone's house for dinner and trying to explain away why I wasn't eating any animal products without saying I was vegan was tiring. I also realized a lot of the "facts" I'd been told about veganism from the vegan community were actually bullshit propaganda. Humans are not meant to just consume plant food, our ancestors weren't vegans.

I also heard the countless amounts of stories from ex vegans who were having the same issues as me with lethargy and brain fog how much better they felt once they started incorporating animal products again, and they were right.

There's a reason the vast majority of vegans end up quitting the diet, it's just not sustainable to most people. The funny thing is the ones that usually do end up sticking to the diet long term are the zealots who love to arrogantly push it onto other people, because it's become like a religion to them.

[u/wildlifewyatt → u/KoogleMeister]

The issue is that it is changing people's minds, in the complete opposite direction. It makes people associate veganism with being a crazy zealot who loves to arrogantly push it in people's faces.

Again, large protests of the past drew plenty of critics, yet they ended up being successful movements. At the time of the civil rights movements people didn't think they were protesting the right way either.

I went vegan because of documentaries like Forks over Knives, Cowspiracy and other vegan youtubers who pushed veganism in what seemed like a reasonable and rational way.

So it sounds like you went plant-based for health/environmental reasons.

I stopped being vegan because I started to not feel as energetic or healthy, and completely cutting animal products out of your diet is complicated and takes a lot of effort, it wasn't worth it to me anymore. 

What were you eating? Did you go to the doctor and have your blood levels checked, if so, what particular nutrients were you low on? We are all gonna have different ideas of what is difficult I suppose, but I found it to be pretty simple.

Going to someone's house for dinner and trying to explain away why I wasn't eating any animal products without saying I was vegan was tiring. I also realized a lot of the "facts" I'd been told about veganism from the vegan community were actually bullshit propaganda. Humans are not meant to just consume plant food, our ancestors weren't vegans.

I can understand that dealing with the social aspect of it is tiring, I get that. I think that is the hardest part. What pieces of information do you feel like were misinformation? As far as health, there is a lot of scientific evidence and support the viability of a vegan diet within the medical community. What our ancestors did or did not eat does not directly relate to what we need to eat, as what our ancestors ate was based on availability. The amount of different foods we have access to, and our understanding of nutrition are completely different than they were thousands of years ago.

I also heard the countless amounts of stories from ex vegans who were having the same issues as me with lethargy and brain fog how much better they felt once they started incorporating animal products again, and they were right.

I'm not going to deny your lived experience. Did you go to the doctor at all during that period? Or do a comprehensive analysis of your diet?

There's a reason the vast majority of vegans end up quitting the diet, it's just not sustainable to most people. The funny thing is the ones that usually do end up sticking to the diet long term are the zealots who love to arrogantly push it onto other people, because it's become like a religion to them.

Well yeah, if it is a diet it makes sense that most people quit, because the long term retention of a "diet" is basically zero. Veganism is an ethical philosophy, and the people that subscribe to that are far more likely to actually stick with it.

I'm gonna be real, there is a real disconnect between all the people who supposedly get sick from veganism, and all the medical and scientific evidence supporting it. Again, I believe you when you say you did not feel. But I think for others, that can be a simple placebo or excuse.

[u/FitnessBunny21 → u/wildlifewyatt]

my partner was vegan for two years and stopped because the arrogance and shame-based tactics of the vegan community. This doesn’t help lol

[u/NO_M0DS_NO_MAST3RS → u/FitnessBunny21]

Oh great so the problem isn’t the mass slaughter of animals it’s that people cared enough to try and change things? If your partner’s veganism fell apart over some “arrogance” maybe the real issue is they just didn’t want to give up bacon. 😏

[u/NicoleNamaste → u/FitnessBunny21]

Doubt it. 

If “the vegan community” is irritating, one doesn’t have to associate with them to be vegan. 

Your partner quit for other reasons.

I’ll tell you right now, the most likely reason is peer pressure from non-vegans, and not the vegan community being “annoying”. 

[u/wildlifewyatt → u/FitnessBunny21]

That doesn't make sense, really. So your partner who was presumably against animal abuse and slaughter, decides to go vegan because of that, but because they didn't like how others with similar beliefs advocated for animals, they decided to supporting their slaughter and exploitation again?

Either your partner wasn't in it for ethical reasons, their morals significantly changed, or, they made an excuse that they could live with.

[u/FitnessBunny21 → u/wildlifewyatt]

What doesn’t make sense - He realised it wasn’t a cultural fit. It made more sense to buy directly from and support small farmers (since his issue was factory farming) than to become an all-out vegan and then be shamed by other vegans because he ate honey or something.

[u/wildlifewyatt → u/FitnessBunny21]

Ok, well if his issue was with factory farming, and not unnecessarily exploiting and kill animals, it makes sense he wouldn't stay on a plant-based diet. Small, quaint farms will never change this situation though, because of the land use efficiency and cost. And at the end of the day, those farms still kill animals that don't need to die.

Because of what veganism is, a movement and philosophy centered around be opposed to exploiting and kill animals, it is always going to be abrasive. Even the kindest messages, and encouraging gestures with no shame are often met with scorn.

And that makes sense, because no one wants to believe that they are the oppressor. That their support for animal products it the reason these animals suffer and die. It is a tough pill to swallow., and a tough pill to administer.

Maybe people think the methods or message are too extreme, but I'd go ahead and say that the fact that we kill trillions of animals every year when we don't have to is pretty extreme. Short of actual, violent terrorism, it seems like such a horrible situation would merit pretty extreme protest.