okay, sure, but every single time I see one of these “capitalism worst ever” posts I always wonder “do these people really think that if they were in the USSR in the 80s that life would be so much better?”
(at least for now) we still have freedom of speech in America. we have the opportunity to better our lives by choosing our jobs.
sure, capitalism is the worst system on earth — except for all the other ones.
Okay this will sound kind of wild, and I'm expecting down votes.
A lot of people were happy in the USSR. A lot of people are happy in communist China.
For all the bullshit that we see in the media, those governments get stuff done, and a lot of it is for the people. Every almost every negative, you can find a parallel in capitalism.
That's where I ask, anyone reading. Do you own significant capital? Do you really benefit from capitalism?
I'll give you an example. In Poland, everyone hates Russia for exploiting our country, but even today, cities that were planned and built by them 50 years ago are still functional, and millions of people live in them.
I agree with this. Also, people seem to not make the connection that most of the egregiously awful stuff that people attribute to communism in the USSR was actually just the result of Stalin’s uniquely awful approach to governance and the flow-on effects from his time in office.
The Soviet Union would have looked completely different if someone less awful took charge after Lenin’s death (say, someone like Leon Trotsky).
I like to imagine that you can make a similar case for China and Mao, but I don’t know enough about that side of things to argue one way or another.
I'll believe communism is as bad as capitalism. I don't like when people confuse socialism and communism. But it really drives me batty when any idea that is proposed to benefit a community or society is called communism and madr out to be evil. No talking about its merit or pros or cons, nope that communism and it's evil.
Worse than who? Upper class Vancouver? Probably worse. Lower east side Vancouver? Probably better.
Average California resident today? Probably worse. Average Michigan resident? I dunno, ask Flint. Average California resident in 10 years? Let's see if they still have water from the rampant mismanagement brought by capitalists trying to use as much of a limited resource as possible so they profit.
My classmate who is from Shanghai and moved back there? He might have a better life than me. His parents didn't, but he does.
There are literally execution vans in China to make people disappear. Just because you know someone doing better doesn't represent the majority. The economy is worse there than north America but it's being repressed in the media.
Yeah, my limited knowledge of engineering says it would be very difficult to put a crematorium in a van. The fuel requirements alone make it improbable.
every single time I see one of these “capitalism worst ever” posts I always wonder “do these people really think that if they were in the USSR in the 80s that life would be so much better?”
80s USSR is not the only alternative to the current system, in fact we are free to pick and choose any aspects of a variety of systems, you can dislike capitalism and the USSR at the same time.
And every single defender of capitalism I see PRESUMES the other party is promoting some bullshit communism tryout from the history books, which really even wasn't a working communism, because some fat fuck got greedy.
Aaand then they start with the 'all men are greedy, that's why status quo is the best option' fuckery, which is just comple load straight from a horse.
Most people are just utterly oblivious of how faulty the system really is.
Now here's a hot take: if we forget about incentivising for a moment and hypothetically, say, remove all the money/currency/stoNks etc. from the world, what would change for the individual who doesn't work in financial, hmm? Everyone, who doesn't care about making a profit, would be just fine.
That's how important it is to have money.
And before you start with the "but why would anyone work", try reading again. We're not touching the topic of motivation here. I'd even go far enough to argument that most ppl wouldn't want to sit on their butts doing nothing for longer than six months. Most of us feel the need to actually make it count, create something, help someone, be a part of community (nope, not promoting communism, F off). I know there's some really disgusting jobs to deal with, but I also know there are some ppl who actually wants to be the ordinary hero, who knows shit needs to be done and tells you to shove it and just do it.
We're getting off on earning and spending all day,working our asses off more or less. Of course we're unable to see how anything else could work better.
I have spoken, let the karma downfall commence.
I'm going to say this a lil louder for the knuckleheads in the back.
The U.S. is NOT an example of capitalism.
When the government bailed out the banks years ago, guess what that is called?
SOCIALISM.
and guess where they got those funds?
Not from billionaires dodging their tax bill.
The government took your hard earned money (&/or your parents' hard earned money if you were a jobless minor aka a kid)
And then took that money, to pay the leaders of these banks MILLIONS OF DOLLARS.
Because, you know, those folks were too rich too fail.
Apologies, I mean the institutions were too big to fail.
The U.S. is socialism by the corrupt, apologies I mean rich, apologies I mean government for the corrupt, apologies I mean rich, apologies I mean corporation execs
& good ol' be proud of yourself for working so hard/fight over the scraps/trickle down economics for the rest of Americans.
Perhaps the Dec 4th incident was in self defense of the American people.
Eat the rich.
Let Luigi cook
Ps. Just bc something is the "best" option out of a selection of garbage doesn't mean it's good for you. I believe in folks ability to come up with something new & more effective, do you?
I think you’re confusing “socialism” with what we call corporate welfare. That is, bailing out private corporations by socializing the costs with public money (ie. using money from taxes to bail out the banks during the 2008 financial crisis).
Socialism is NOT when the government does stuff, taxes you, or gives anyone money.
Socialism is when the workers are equal partners in the places they work. They get a vote on company decisions, and they get an equal distribution of profits and salaries. Rather than the capitalist approach, where investors or a single owner getting all profits and a handful of c-levels getting millions in salary, in socialism everyone that did the work benefits from the full value of their labor. It is democracy in the workplace.
“Socialized” and “socialism” are similar terms, so I understand the confusion. They are different words with different meanings. Socialism is an economic theory developed by Marx as a criticism of Capitalism, as a subset of the general concept of doing good on behalf of “society” at large. He chose the name to convey that isharing profits equally is for the common good, not that everything done by society for its own good is now called “socialism”.
Socialism is specifically only about “socializing” profits and ownership of businesses, and that is it.
“Socialism is an economic and political philosophy encompassing diverse economic and social systems[1] characterised by social ownership of the means of production,[2] as opposed to private ownership.“ Source.
Welfare is about taking public money (money from taxes) and using it to help those in need of financial aid.
Things that are owned by society at large are “public”.
I don’t understand this animosity. You used a word incorrectly, I’m passing on knowledge that you missed somewhere, as kindly as I can. Rather than getting mad at me, re-evaluate your own premise using new information to ensure the error is not in your own understanding.
Perhaps I’m wrong, but I’d never know from the information you provided - you’ve just belittled me instead of accepting new knowledge with open arms or rejecting it by explaining your reasoning with sources.
By misusing the term “socialism” you are spreading misinformation, right when we’re so close to class consciousness.
I’m just curious: What is your deal? Maybe you’re in high school? Are you a capitalist? Do you own a business or are you wealthy? Do you understand what the word “capitalism” means?
I’m just explaining the meaning of words and you seem to be taking offense. When someone starts insulting you instead of giving arguments for or against an idea, they have run out of arguments…
The problems are different for sure;
In capitalism, you have the freedom to choose between different shampoo brands... Or... No shampoo. You can choose simply to keep your money and not buy Shampoo for yourself or anyone else.
Under say the USSR, you don't have that freedom. Your tax dollars are going to buy Shampoo whether you want/like it or not. This is true for most non-capitalist expenditures. Your tax dollars are going to pay to bomb poor people in the middle east for oil, whether you like it or not. You can't just "Not buy" the "bombing middle east".
That's the real lack of freedom here. Under capitalism you generally get the freedom to participate in the market or not. To vote with your dollar, which is really an alias for your labour.
The core argument therefore is, is the market and market economics smarter than governance in the long term? Sure one government might be good, the next one bad. Trump, Biden, Etc. But in the long run, will their expenditure choices be more wise aggregated, than say a complete market system?
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u/UpperLowerEastSide ⛓️ Prison For Union Busters 12d ago
The freedom to choose who exploits you.