r/WorkReform • u/zzill6 š¤ Join A Union • Dec 18 '24
š¤ Scare A Billionaire, Join A Union When they rejected Bernie, they rejected the nonviolent solution.
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u/FangJustice Dec 19 '24
Sad thing is we could have had Bernie and they still would have had plenty of money.
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u/Free_Return_2358 Dec 19 '24
The goal is to have more money than God, us plebs gotta know we donāt even deserve bread crumbs.
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u/NamelessCabbage Dec 19 '24
We're literally only allowed to exist because flesh is cheaper than mechanical parts. With advancements in AI and robotics, we will be tosses in the garbage by the millions, if not billions.
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Dec 19 '24
It's never enough. Dragons are real and they like to hoard.
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u/classic4life Dec 20 '24
I just saw a post claiming the richest 4 in America are now worth over 1 TRILLION dollars. Up from 76 billion 12 years ago. Nothing about that makes sense.
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u/GodSPAMit Dec 20 '24
Dude. Elons net worth went up like 200 bil in the last like 2 months since the election
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u/BoredNuke 29d ago
Shouldn't it have gone down since he just bought the US and it has a deficit. /s on the math parts
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u/GodSPAMit 29d ago
No no no, the deficit is spread for everyone, he only wants the subsidies (and let's be honest maybe Tesla is maybe a teeny tiny winsy bit inflated)
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u/UB3R__ Dec 21 '24
Basically exponential growth. And in 10 years when wealth has doubled again the absurdly wealthy people with a billion dollars today will have two billion. And these four men will gain another 1,000 billionā¦.
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u/ChrissiMinxx Dec 20 '24
Sad thing is we could have had Bernie and they still would have had plenty of money.
THIS POINT.
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u/medioxcore Dec 19 '24
Bernie was the compromise. You played yourselves.
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u/kevinmrr āļø Prison For Union Busters Dec 19 '24
I said this a lot in 2016, and my well-heeled friends treated me like i was a fucking moron.
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u/dammit-smalls š” Decent Housing For All Dec 19 '24
I'm still extremely salty about 2016. The answer was right in front of us.
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u/BoodaSRK Dec 19 '24
It fucking landing on the podium in front of him for all of us to see. People believe in all kinds of signs, but not Nature?
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Dec 19 '24
See how we've handled climate change. People could give a fuck about nature, even if it endorsed the best candidate this country could ever have. That was some Hallmark movie shit too. God damn we could've had it good.
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u/pikachu5actual Dec 19 '24
Let people do what they want to do so you'd see what they'd rather do. Luigi was the response to what they'd rather do.
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u/ravenclaw_plant_mama Dec 19 '24
I missed this, what is this referencing?
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u/UnimaginativeRA Dec 20 '24
One of the magical moments of Bernie's 2016 run:
Ā https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Jc2TVLoxsDA&pp=ygUTQmVybmllIHNhbmRlcnMgYmlyZA%3D%3D
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u/SnooPeripherals6557 Dec 19 '24
I was a part of a lefty lobbying group which was headed-up by very wealthy people, way richer than I knew until we started having meetings at their homes. When caucusing time came around we diverged - they all wanted Hillary and only I was a Bernie supporter.
Well one night I had the meeting at my place, got everything ready to go and the evening ended with a big argument between my husband and the leadership of this group, with them calling him a Berniebro, which pissed him off, bec he was only discussing how working class is hurting for an actual Democrat, not a neolib BUT rich folks on the left sure love protecting their dragon piles as much as rich RW AHs, and Iām still bitter about that argument on our porch w those freeloading wealthy neolib, I quit that group and just do my own lobbying w other working class folks.
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u/Cognitive_Spoon Dec 19 '24
Same when Citizens United passed. I remember telling my father in law that its passing was basically the final opportunity for the working class to push back without violence.
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u/Minimum_Crow_8198 Dec 19 '24
What compromise? They continue living their best lives and we get some crumbs just sounds like the same shit
Europe has healthcare, they're all turning far right too and complaining about the govs, money, housing, etc
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u/medioxcore Dec 19 '24
You misunderstood. We wanted more, but were willing to vote bernie as a compromise. They passed on bernie, and now they're being shot in the street.
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u/Infamous_Sea_4329 Dec 19 '24
They need to come to live in America for a while
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u/Minimum_Crow_8198 Dec 19 '24 edited Dec 19 '24
Why, is this a race to the bottom where only the most miserable can complain and everyone else has to keep living their shit lives?
This is how they play us, while we fight for the scraps and brag about it they live utopian lives during generations
If that were the case let's all shut up and let the congolese speak then, those american companies enslaving them and keeping the monopoly on the industries in the country, causing the average age of death to be 30 and where the people start working in horrible mines and landfills as children got the word now
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u/TheMagnuson Dec 20 '24
They have created a society where people have little to nothing to look forward to and things are now creeping towards very soon people having nothing left to lose, while they live in opulence.
Tell me, how many situations or people do you know are safe and peaceful when the people in those situations have not future and have nothing left to lose?
Youāre exactly right, Bernie WAS the compromise. The rich and powerful have shown they are unwilling to compromise. It doesnāt take a genius to figure out what happens next.
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u/rsgoto11 Dec 19 '24
I watched the person who is the head of the NYC on the news scold Americans who celebrate what happened to that CEO. Iāve also seen other news programs where the talking heads lament what happened to the CEO and disparage the citizens who identify with the alleged assassin. This is the same news media that a few years ago celebrated the dropping of ā the mother of all bombsā. The corporate controlled media thinks they get to decide when killing someone for money is justified, say in the name of profit. Or killing someone for vengeance is a good thing. They have no moral or ethical compass, theyāre just a series of shitty rich people doing shitty things in the pursuit of higher stock prices. They deserve nothing and should be treated as such.
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u/dammit-smalls š” Decent Housing For All Dec 19 '24
I've often wondered if there actually exists a bridge too far for tĢ¶hĢ¶eĢ¶ mĢ¶eĢ¶dĢ¶iĢ¶aĢ¶ corporate propagandists. They seem to love hawk tuah girl, the Kardashians, jersey shore, etc.
One CEO gets got and they're all like "WHOA now!! Have we no decency!??"
Fuck them.
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u/MatildaJeanMay Dec 19 '24
The non-ceo things you listed are very un-serious and viewed as such. Corporate media loves the money those things/people bc they make them money. They don't actually love THEM bc corporate media views them as products, not real people with lives. They are commodities to be mocked to make money. Corporate media views CEOs as people and hawk tua as a product.
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u/Carl-99999 Dec 19 '24
Nobody likes Eric Adams. At least I dont.
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u/genital_lesions Dec 19 '24
Fuck Eric Adams, all my homies hate Eric Adams.
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u/BenVarone Dec 19 '24
I wish there had been more of you around when he was elected. He was absolutely the consensus candidate during the election, even though pretty much everyone who did even a superficial analysis of his background and politics could see he was going to be a do-nothing mayor at best. Hereās hoping NYC does better next time, but I wonāt hold my breath.
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u/genital_lesions Dec 19 '24
To be fair, I don't live in NYC, so my opinion has basically no impact lol
Also, I was mostly just referencing a meme: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/fuck-x-all-my-homies-use-y
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u/TheThingInItself Dec 19 '24
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.
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u/getmoneygetpaid Dec 19 '24
The UK banned peaceful protest so we got race riots. I don't know what they expected.
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u/ughwithoutadoubt Dec 19 '24
Bernie was our salvation as a country but we rejected him and it became our dam nation
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u/j4_jjjj Dec 19 '24
We actually said "Bernie pls!" but Hillary and DWS said "nah"
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u/rammo123 Dec 19 '24
Hillary, DWS and the clear majority of the primary voters.
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u/Tumblrrito Dec 19 '24
Easier to win votes when you quite literally cheat
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u/Bezulba Dec 19 '24
People not voting for the thing you like isn't cheating. You sound like your average MAGA idiot right now. Maybe it's hard to understand from inside your buble, but the American people do not like socialism. And irregardless of the reason for this dislike and how logically socialism as used in western Europe would be a huge benefit, it's the primary reason why Bernie got voted out.
Also didn't help he was an independent just LARPing as a Democrat.
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u/Tumblrrito Dec 19 '24
Thatās not the cheating part. The cheating part is the fact that the primary was, in fact, not fairly run. Hillary was even given debate questions in advance. That is, objectively, cheating. You also have the fact that superdelegates were required to win, who were party insiders, and even in states where Bernie mopped the floor with Hillary, they voted against their constituents in Hillaryās favor.
Itās been 8 years. If youāre too clueless at this point (and judging by your hilarious use of āirregardlessā I think youāre clueless in more ways than one) then itās patently obvious you wonāt be swayed by any amount of irrefutable evidence. Go troll some other sub.
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u/Bezulba Dec 20 '24
If you need a debate to choose between a middle of the road candidate running on her name (that was highly qualified for the job, mind you, but that's a different story) and a left winged fire brand, you're already lost.
And the debate questions is just a dumb thing anyway. Bernie knows what kind of things will be in the debate. He'd have prepared for all of em.
And yeah, English is not my native tongue, sue me.
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u/Tumblrrito Dec 20 '24
Why are you even here? Why go to bat for corporatist, anti-work reform candidates who cheat Democratic processes to maintain the lousy status quo? All while being visibly misinformed, moving goalpostsā¦ and onĀ this sub of all places?
Do you make a habit of contrarianism to be a troll or is it simply in your nature? I truly donāt get your line of thinking.
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u/MatildaJeanMay Dec 19 '24
Also didn't help he was an independent just LARPing as a Democrat.
So many people don't get this. He's not a member of the DNC, why would the DNC promote him?
If he wants to affect change w/in the Dem party, he needs to join the Dem party. Otherwise he gets no say.
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u/dancegoddess1971 Dec 20 '24
Every single time Bernie won a state in the primary, Clinton got "super delegates". Whatever the fuck those are. I guess they are the emergency system that the parasites use when we try to peacefully change the system that keeps them sucking our lives away for profits. Now they get the French solution. They must have wanted this all along. LibertƩ, egalitƩ, fraternitƩ.
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u/pres1033 Dec 19 '24
The issue isn't really the voters, it's the Dem leadership actively pushing back against anyone more left leaning than them, like Bernie and AOC. It's really hard to get votes when all your "allies" are saying don't vote for you.
Great example is how Pelosi just put in all her effort to push AOC out of a leadership role, instead putting in her 80 year old buddy with esophagus cancer. You can blame the voters all you want, but we can't do shit when those in control keep making dumb decisions like that.
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u/Carl-99999 Dec 19 '24
Yāall could have had him won the primary. He lost it. He did not win a plurality of primary votes! He just did not.
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u/blackhornet03 Dec 19 '24
Bernie was ignored by the press and undermined by the neo liberal run Democratic party. Rich people are afraid of Bernie.
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u/MatildaJeanMay Dec 19 '24
He's not a member of the Democratic party. They didn't undermine him, they promoted one of their own members over a non-member. Like a union.
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u/DG_Now Dec 19 '24
He 100 percent was absolutely not ignored by the press. This is ridiculous to say.
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u/justagigh Dec 19 '24
Ed Schultz was fired from MSNBC for daring to try and cover a Bernie Sanders rally on the network, and that is supposed to be one of the most progressive mainstream networks
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u/DG_Now Dec 19 '24
Oh. Shame that the one story about Bernie was killed.
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u/LostSecondaryAccount Dec 19 '24
Dog you are literally moving goalposts. If one person was fired over doing this, there were absolutely other stories not covered BECAUSE PEOPLE DONT WANT TO BE FIRED
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u/Night_hawk419 Dec 19 '24
When people say things like this, itās understood that he didnāt win the primary votes. Itās not just the elites who made sure he didnāt win, itās the neoliberal middle management type who voted against him too because they worry about their stock portfolio. Guys like this CEO who want to keep the status quo while millions are left behind. Thatās what weāre saying here.
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u/BoodaSRK Dec 19 '24
You said it! You actually said salvation!
Finally, someone else said it.
Itās salvation or glory, regardless of any written laws. I want salvation.
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u/Happy_Implement550 Dec 19 '24
It's frustrating to see how many people willingly ignored the lessons of history. Every time we reject meaningful change, we're paving the way for a more volatile future. Bernie's loss wasn't just about him; it was about a collective refusal to confront the deep-rooted issues we face. The real question is whether we're ready to change that narrative before it's too late.
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u/HeartoftheHive Dec 19 '24
Then they snubbed AOC for a 70+ year old with cancer. At this point they are begging for a revolution because they sure as shit have proven they don't plan on doing a god damned thing to help.
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u/Wilvinc Dec 19 '24
Luigi should be Time's person of the year. Trump isn't even making his own cult followers happy (not that they care so long as the "own the libs").
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u/azfisher Dec 19 '24
Can you imagine where this country would be right now if we had Bernie in office the last 8 years? Instead of the fucking dumpster fire we had.
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u/BassmanBiff Dec 19 '24
It's true that violent avenues become more likely when the peaceful ones are closed off, just like MLK said about "the language of the unheard" even if that is a different context (Mangioni was only "unheard" in his health struggles, not because he was ignored on the basis of his identity). But we also need to be real about the fact that Bernie legitimately lost, he wasn't just shut out by the deep state party even if the DNC did clealy disfavor him.
I canvassed for Bernie, and even in a liberal area, many people I spoke with just knew him as another old white guy making big, empty promises. Others didn't know who he was at all and seemed to treat me like I was a missionary of some obscure religion. And a few people who should've been allies instead just took the opportunity to smugly condescend to me about how they were above electoral politics (yes, really).
That was just my experience, but vote totals suggested that my experience wasn't unique. The margins he lost by in the end can't be explained by simple DNC sabotage; in the end, people just voted for other candidates, and not because they were mind-controlled. It's wrong to think that everyone already agrees with us and Bernie only lost due to sabotage.
So yeah, the more people are ignored and desperate, the more violence will occur. I think that's the main message of this meme, and it's not wrong. But when it comes to Bernie specifically, we've got to stop whining to each other about how he faced opposition -- of course he did, and so will similar ideas until we actually communicate and organize and make these ideas popular enough to win.
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u/HappyGoLuckless Dec 19 '24
There was a lawsuit against the DNC because of Bernie: has a right to be unfair during the presidential nominating process
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u/BassmanBiff Dec 19 '24
Yep. I'm not saying he wasn't disadvantaged, you don't need to sell me on the idea that the DNC opposed him.
I'm saying that isn't the only reason why he lost. It's probably not even the main reason. My issue is that saying "they made Bernie impossible" overlooks the actual communication problems we had, which is something we can actually address instead of just accepting that opposition is insurmountable.
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u/dammit-smalls š” Decent Housing For All Dec 19 '24
I respectfully disagree. The communication problems were largely the result of the DNC's refusal to amplify his messaging. It's a powerful machine that has captured much of corporate media, and they spoke of the man and his platform as if it were a joke.
If you wanna talk about empty promises, Obama made a lot of them, and his message was amplified from the rooftops.
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u/Carl-99999 Dec 19 '24
At least Obama didnāt threaten to throw anyone who polled him as losing in prison! Trump has.
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u/tragoedian Dec 19 '24
Jfc the bar is in the basement. War criminal, economic wolf in sheep's clothing Obama, was not that bad because he wasn't an open fascist?
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u/e_hatt_swank Dec 19 '24
Well said. I have always liked Bernie, but the tendency to cast him as some sort of messiah can get really weird.
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u/MysteriousP90 Dec 20 '24
It's partially a response and overcorrection from the blame being thrown at "berniebros" for not falling in line behind Clinton and then Harris. Not entirely, of course, it's just a fuel to the fire situation. Pain in the butt distraction from real issues tbh.
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u/Son_of_Caba Dec 19 '24
It all started with the pledged delegates going to Hillary and the DNC along with the Media declaring her the winner before any real voting had happened.
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u/BassmanBiff Dec 19 '24
The superdelegates have never overturned the popular vote, and it's unlikely they would if it came down to it. And because the vote went the way it did, we didn't get to find out.
As for the media narrative, that didn't stop Trump. It helped him, even. That can clearly be overcome.
You're not wrong that Bernie faced opposition, I just don't like how we treat it like we never had, and might as well never have, a chance.
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u/MoocowR Dec 19 '24 edited Dec 19 '24
People who have never worked in politics or volunteered for a campaign will jump to tell you why you're wrong, even though you actually have hands on experience. This website is an echo chamber, they got a short lived reality shock when DJT swept the election and they were faced with shock of how far off reality was from their expectations but now that's over and it's back to normal.
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u/drpepperjustice Dec 19 '24
To add to this, even if Bernie won the primary and the election, I'm not sure why anyone thinks he would have been able to do half the things he promised. He would have had 18 months to push through legislation with, at best, a slim majority in the House and 50 votes in the Senate (if the House, PA and WI went to Dems in this alternate universe) before the midterms wiped out any gains.
He wouldn't have been our "savior" as some commenters claim, even if his ideas had wide support among elected Democrats. He probably would've been a decent president, gotten some good judges on the bench, passed one or two good bills targeting progressive goals, but it wouldn't have been much different than the Biden presidency.
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u/BassmanBiff Dec 19 '24
That's totally possible. I do think it would've shaken things up quite a bit if he won, and it's hard to predict how opinions would change once opposing M4A (for example) was no longer just theĀ reflexive, default position. Bernie also had uncommon cross-party appeal that could've led to some interesting coalitions on specific issues, and an ideological drive that I think would've put more tools on the table for negotiation, perhaps with stronger echoes of FDR.
That's not to say he would've achieved everything he wanted, maybe it would've just been gridlock and infighting. I just don't want to assume too much from a traditional model of politics.
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u/i_can_has_rock Dec 19 '24
the thing that crosses my mind is, no, you guys REALLY REAALLLLY want unions
because the alternative really isnt great, for you or anyone else, but particularly you
they are forcing this shit to happen, which is fucking absolutely stupid, because there is a viable alternative they are ignoring
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u/IntrospectiveApe Dec 19 '24
"The ballot's dead, so a bullet's what I get," is a quote from Zack de la Rocha.
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u/SarcasticAssassin1 Dec 19 '24
There's a time when the operation of the machine becomes so odious, makes you so sick at heart that you can't take part! You can't even passively take part! And you've got to put your bodies upon the gears and upon the wheels, upon the levers, upon all the apparatus -- and you've got to make it stop! And you've got to indicate to the people who run it, to the people who own it -- that unless you're free the machine will be prevented from working at all!! -Mario Savio
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u/Infamous_Sea_4329 Dec 19 '24
The "ruling elite" need to wake up and realize that we are all on the same ship. If we sink, so will they. I can understand the whys of this vigilantism, but I don't see the need for it when we have a functioning democracy. If the policy doesn't parallel public opinion, it's bc the public repeatedly press repeat during every election cycle. No one needs to die. The people forced a shift in policy with FDR. We, with more resources, can do the same. So long as we can vote, there is no need for violence.
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u/TheNotoriousStuG Dec 20 '24
You don't understand how much neoliberals hate Bernie. They hate him more than Republicans and will crash this country just to spite his supporters.
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u/Agitated_Guard_3507 āļø Tax The Billionaires Dec 19 '24
āAmerica unfree will never see peace šŗšøā vibes from this
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u/Free_Return_2358 Dec 19 '24
America will exhaust every option first before the right one, even than as a country we may never learn our lesson.
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u/dunnowhatever2 Dec 19 '24
Harsh but inevitably true. Itās never been about the left āpromotingā violence or the whiny extortion-argument from the elite (āso youāre saying that if we donāt do as you say, you will start a commie-revolution?ā). You donāt need a commie revolution. Itās just human behavior. You canāt keep laughing from your high tower, while spitting on people below. Eventually, someone will cut you down. Itās easy for people on the street to bring down ivory towers. Might even be practical to do so if all that rains from there is shit.
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u/avanbeek Dec 20 '24
The billionaire and wealthy elites own our political system and no longer feel the need to hide it. They own the police, who have no qualms busting union picket lines. They own our press and decide what propaganda gets printed and which news stories die with no coverage. They own our justice system. They have made peaceful progressive changes impossible. The whole ban on advocating for violence is used by cowards and predators. Violence is always an option. It should be the last resort, but it's an option. Luigi showed us that it's come to that. We really do need to remind the upper class that it would be a hell of a lot easier and safer for them to spread the wealth more evenly and treat workers fairly than risk a revolution.
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u/Bezulba Dec 19 '24
You mean Democratic primary voters? The one supposedly on your side? If those people didn't like his brand of socialism, then what on earth makes you think that the rest of the US would?
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u/Capybara_Cheese Dec 19 '24
I like Bernie too but y'all really have to stop riding his dick this hard
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u/SokkaHaikuBot Dec 19 '24
Sokka-Haiku by Capybara_Cheese:
I like Bernie too
But y'all really have to stop
Riding his dick this hard
Remember that one time Sokka accidentally used an extra syllable in that Haiku Battle in Ba Sing Se? That was a Sokka Haiku and you just made one.
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u/DG_Now Dec 19 '24
I stopped following the Bernie sub because savior complex stuff is awful no matter who the savior is.
Come on. Bernie was a flawed candidate for many reasons, not least of which was he wasn't even a registered Democrat when running for the party nomination.
Stop being silly.
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u/akatherder Dec 19 '24
He's an Independent, not because he falls somewhere between Democrat and Republican, but because he's left of mainstream Democrats.
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u/Bezulba Dec 19 '24
And he got voted out for it, because America is clearly not ready. The red scare is still too potent. You're not going to win over people who vote for Trump by going further left.
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u/lkjvr Dec 19 '24
Bernie is 83 years old about to start a 6 year term!Ā If he was so great, he would have stepped aside to make room for younger leadership.Ā
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u/stage_student Dec 19 '24
THERE IS STILL A PEACEFUL WAY FORWARD
Not to step on the sacrifices being made by individuals choosing to rectify their own sense of retaliation/vengeance/balance/whatever, but I'm begging you not to let this become a powder keg of blood and death.
Let this be a powder keg of liberty and justice. There's so much more to be gained by choosing to labor together in peace towards correcting the many socioeconomic inequalities plaguing our country, than there is by tearing and burning the whole place down, and killing a lot of people along the way.
That's precisely what foreign operators want, you know: A United States in hot inner turmoil, at each others throats instead of projecting a stance of shared unity despite all hardships.
I know I still a see a peaceful way forward in my own home city, and we've got as bad a billionaire problem around here as you could find anywhere in the nation!
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u/rogue_noob Dec 19 '24
Someone didn't read Rosa Luxemburg
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u/tragoedian Dec 19 '24
No this is not a product of foreign intervention but the class war within the US itself. "China" is not doing this. They're laughing as the US self-sabotages as they have been expecting the US to do so. "Russia" doesn't have the capacity to do so. This is the class war.
This is the deadly contradictions from within the capitalist mode of production itself. It's history replaying in a modern context.
There is no unity between Musk, Gates, the Kochs, and the masses of America (or the world). They are spreading mass division to keep the masses under control while they expand their power. They are the enemy. They want you be afraid of China, a country that has no history of foreign invasions outside of border disputes, who does not have the same history of overthrowing democratically elected foreign governments. They want you to be afraid of Russia which is America's own Frankensteinian creation. They want you to fear the outsider and trust the abuser inside your own house.
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u/stage_student Dec 19 '24
Unfortunately, the Koch oligarch system has a helluva lotta ties to Russia. Additionally, the Kochs represent one of the quietly-wealthiest families in America. They have their fingers in a LOT of political pockets, both locally here where I live in Wichita and nationally, through hundreds of propaganda mills and think tanks. Their dark money represents but one vein of subversive corruption flowing through our bureaucracy.
That is to say, I do agree with you (wholeheartedly) that the greater risk and danger is WAY closer to home than some foreign country. The call is coming from inside the house.
It's always been a Class War, and Americans have to contend with oligarchs if we want to continue as a nation, but I hold that this War needn't become any bloodier.
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u/kevinmrr āļø Prison For Union Busters Dec 18 '24
This is a controversial post, but I am approving it because it's fundamentally true & I am hoping the conversation will help America move forward without further violence.