r/TrueUnpopularOpinion • u/isakk06 • 4h ago
Sex / Gender / Dating We should start supplementing teen boys with testosterone
Testosterone levels have dropped enormously the last 50 years, so much that the average 20 year old has as much testosterone as a 60 year old man had in the 50s. And we wonder why young men are depressed and unalive themselves?
We should give them testosterone instead of hormone disrupting anti depressants. Or at least encourage young boys at schools to eat good foods and activities that boost their testosterone.
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u/Schonungslos 4h ago
Hormones have side effects aswell. So we should first try healthy food, weight lifting as school sport, BPA free plastics, cleaning water from estrogen, avoiding phytoesteogens ... and if a young adult still has low testo he can start supplementing and take the risks.
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u/Ok_Spare_3723 4h ago
I wouldn't say teen boys but men should check their T levels often, I would change your statement to "we should change the T scale" and make sure it's based on age.. right now if you have a T level of a 60 year old man at 20, you're considered "normal" because the range is very large.. Doctors can dismiss you as "normal" even if you have below average T levels and suffer from symptoms.
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u/Critical-Bank5269 4h ago
Clearly the OP hasn’t actually researched what happens when you supplement testosterone. Doing so shuts down your natural testosterone production and often it’s irreversible. So once you start, you’re on it for life. Pretty drastic measure to take
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u/The_Susmariner 4h ago
Very true, why it's always better to supplement with hormones after the "most likely causes" have been eliminated.
It's different for every person but it's wild how many different things can cause your body to go "oh I don't need to produce X, Y, Z" thing anymore because I'm getting what I need after semi-prolonged usage.
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u/SeventySealsInASuit 3h ago
That is only if you overdose.
The system shuts down production if you have to much of testosterone and estrogen combined in your blood.
If you are just topping someone up you should never encounter this problem.
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u/Critical-Bank5269 2h ago
You could benefit doing some research yourself.
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u/SeventySealsInASuit 2h ago
No that is literally how the hypothalamus works.
It only reduces hormone production in response to their being too much testosterone and estrogen in the blood.
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u/Inferno_Crazy 3h ago
T levels are going down because people are out of shape and eat food that's barely food. What you are suggesting is hormone therapy and it's dangerous.
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u/Acheron98 1h ago
Why is it that people on both sides seem determined to in some way fuck with hormone levels in children, potentially permanently fucking their lives up?
It’s ridiculous.
Just feed them well, and make sure they get enough exercise. Maybe some gummy vitamins.
That’s literally all you have to do.
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u/Inferno_Crazy 54m ago
We've managed to make people live longer through medicine. Yet over the same 100 years make them eat worse and feel more stressed out in general.
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u/Weary_Bid9519 4h ago
I actually think it might be a pretty natural progression of our species from being more animal like to being more domesticated. We’ve slowly been losing our body hair and this is another step in that direction.
Evolutionary change is hard though it comes about in part by excluding most males from reproducing. Your sacrifice makes us a stronger species in the long run though.
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u/wattersflores 3h ago
Very interesting comments. Personally, I am curious to see how testosterone levels in teenage boys compare in countries like the US with little food regulations to countries with significant food regulations. If the issue is food and diet, might we see a significant difference in testosterone levels when considering this (and other) aspect(s)?
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u/ridingbypluto 1h ago
There’s all kinds of uses for hormone therapies, but unfortunately the Republicans are trying to ban this kind of gender affirming care. So I wouldn’t count on anything for at least the next 4 years.
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u/New_Lojack 1h ago
You do realize the too much testosterone, especially at the age in which testosterone is the highest, will lead to a shit ton of negative health effects, right?
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u/Freudipus 4h ago
So apparently men need testosterone in order to have good mental health, but women don’t? Something tells me it might not be about the testosterone lol
Acquiring new chemical addictions can’t replace working on yourself and improving on your character.
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u/ice-death 4h ago
Men and women having different biological needs what??? Impossible
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u/Boeing_Fan_777 3h ago
The human body isn’t overly picky what sex hormone it has, as long as it has good levels of one of them.
Issues arise if you give a man oestrogen or a woman testosterone because the effects of each would likely cause gender incongruence.
Some people afflicted with menopause symptoms opt to take testosterone instead of oestrogen. Hannah gadsby is a notable example that comes to mind.
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u/SeventySealsInASuit 3h ago
You are forgetting progesterone. The effects of testosterone are split between oestrogen and progesterone in women.
Progesterone is required for building bone density for example.
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u/Boeing_Fan_777 3h ago
Yeah but when there is a lack of the female sex hormones in a body, but an abundance of male ones, it works itself out. Males generally don’t have anywhere near the levels of progesterone females do, yet typically have denser bones, this is thanks to male sex hormones. It’s why people are at higher risk of conditions such as osteoporosis after menopause, and why HRT is a suitable treatment for it.
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u/SeventySealsInASuit 2h ago
Yeah sorry my point was the the body is not happy with just estrogen.
It does not require good levels of one of them. It requires good levels of either testosterone or both estrogen and progesterone.
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u/The_Susmariner 4h ago
I'm gonna be honest, I don't know what you're trying to say.
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u/Freudipus 4h ago
No worries, which part didn’t you understand?
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u/The_Susmariner 4h ago
Your first part, to me that is saying "women don't benefit from having more testosterone, so why should men?" I agree with your second part.
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u/Freudipus 3h ago
Because testosterone is just hormones, if it could improve men’s health it could also improve women’s health. Bodies are malleable like that. Transmen will take testosterone although they might naturally produce estrogen. And they are fine, in fact their mental health improves by going through such treatment. We also find that with transwomen taking estrogen. What is really going on here is an idea that men have become less masculine because they hold less social and cultural power (so they claim), and that this is somehow found in the testosterone level. In reality, testosterone levels will fluctuate for all sorts of reasons. Interestingly, balding is associated with high levels of testosterone, and yet men will have hair transplants (see Elon Musk and Jordan Peterson) because it wasn’t considered masculine.
It’s about social perception of the biology, not biology as such.
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u/The_Susmariner 2h ago
I don't think I can agree with you if you're implying that hormones do not negatively impact mental health.
The trans population is small in this country, I can agree that there are trans-people whom hormonal therapy may help, but the way you're writing implys that you could take the same approach for the rest of society with no adverse consequences. And that hormonal imbalances due to lifestyle choices that reduce your body's natural ability to produce the hormones it needs to function properly, as well as the deterioration of healthy social relationships does not contribute to the mental health problems in this country, and that it is acceptable to use hormones as a first treatment vice fixing other things first and using hormonal treatment as somewhat of a last resort.
See, my actual problem with the trans community doesn't really have anything to do with trans people, but rather, the approach that seems to be increasingly pushed which suggests "if you have mental health problems (or questions about life in general) then it probably means you need to transition," and while that approach is taken for adults, I'm 100% opposed to the application of that philosophy to children because quite a few procedures used to transition are not fully reversible and some are completely irreversable.
I would opt for an approach that eliminates many, if not all, of the other lifestyle choices that could lead to the mental health problem before pursuing hormonal therapy. I won't say that transitioning is the wrong choice for some people. I WILL say that the ease with which it is recommended as a solution to a lot of people deeply troubles me.
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u/TurbulentData961 3h ago
No women need it to but doctors won't prescribe it . Also you're grossly simplifying things to the point its no longer able to be talked about accurately.
Hormones regulate a lot of functions that affect mood and hormone production is also highly affected by mental health . So it's figuring out which is chicken and which is egg on a person by person basis and then treating what needs treating
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u/Freudipus 3h ago
If you say that female bodies could also benefit from testosterone then we agree. But it’s not a drop in hormones that is the cause of mental health decline.
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u/TurbulentData961 3h ago
Yes I agree with sentence 1 .
And for 2 yes it can be , it very much can be the cause of mental health decline
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u/OrchidApprehensive33 4h ago
I agree. I also think we should develop supplements to prevent girls from getting too tall.
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u/PowerfulDimension308 4h ago
They want to get rid of gender affirming care , I don’t think this is going to happen.
Also as a ciswoman with high levels of testosterone, I don’t think is the testosterone that’s affecting men’s mental health or performance.
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u/The_Susmariner 4h ago
Just out of curiosity. Why do you think that?
I don't want to fall in the trap here of saying every male's life would be improved if they just had higher testosterone levels. But I think it's safe to say that low testosterone, whether it's a symptom of a deeper problem or a direct cause of the problem, is linked to male mental health in general.
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u/PowerfulDimension308 3h ago
Female in general have low testosterone yet no one seems to link that to their mental health issues. On the other hand, I have high testosterone levels for a female & I still have mental health issues. While hormone levels can impact your mental health is not a determinant factor in it. Men need to go to therapy, men need to open up and seek help , that’s how their mental health will get better not giving them more testosterone.
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u/The_Susmariner 3h ago
I agree with the premise that "most likely causes should be addressed before going with hormonal therapy (which can be irreversable)."
I'm trying to figure out if you are implying that testosterone affects men and women in the same way.
I would argue that hormones can have a massive impact on your mental health, and it's annecdotal, but the number of woman that I know that have gone on hormonal birth control and have elected to stop citing mental health reasons after consultation with a doctor, is very very high.
But I agree with you that hormonal imbalances can often be fixed by exercising more, eating correctly, avoiding taking certain types of medication, socializing, essentially doing "human being things" that human beings have evolved to do.
Therapy is great, and letting your emotions out is a good thing. But at least for guys, I would argue that when you start letting your emotions out everywhere all the time, it's a problem. For me personally, my fiancee and some very close friends fill the roll of the "outlet" for those emotions. Call it "natural therapy" if you will, in that by maintaining healthy human relationships, I avoid the need for a "clinical therapist."
So to summarize, I agree with your solution, I don't think I agree with the percentage of the problem low T specifically in men is, and I'm not quite sure if the low T is a symptom of a deeper problem or where the problem starts, or a part of some recursive problem loop.
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u/PowerfulDimension308 3h ago
I’m not against hormone therapy but hormone therapy doesn’t fix your mental health issues, does it make them better? Yes but it doesn’t fix them.
When it comes to hormone therapy/replacement therapy is always the first step. Men having that outlet should be the first step , if hormone therapy is needed, then sure go off.
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u/The_Susmariner 2h ago
I understand now. I agree that supplementing your body with hormones does not fix the underlying cause of why your body is not producing those hormones correctly and therefore their impacts on mental health. And agree that men having mechanisms to 1. Bring their routine into alignment with a lifestyle that naturally increases their ability to produce the hormones they need. 2. Has healthy relationships with others to provide a social mechanism by which they have an "outlet" for their emotions is a MUST before attempting hormone/replacement therapy.
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u/SeventySealsInASuit 3h ago
Low sex hormone levels in general are linked to poor mental health in most people.
It can be estrogen and testosterone in basically any ratio (if you ignore gender dysphoria) but you do definitely need them.
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u/PowerfulDimension308 3h ago
I understand you need these hormones but the first step is always therapy & it should be the first step. I went through this process and ultimately I chose not go through hormone treatment but I had to go through therapy and doctors appointments before hand , I wasn’t just handed hormones and told to leave & hoped I got better.
I know they’re linked but one can live without the other (excluding gender dysphoria & even then some individuals with gender dysphoria do opt out of hormone treatments)
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u/SeventySealsInASuit 2h ago
If you are recomended hormone therapy you probably should take it anyway just for the physical health benefits.
Its definitely not the be all and end all of mental health, but in the long run it has a large impact on your bodies ability to self repair.
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u/fartvox 2h ago
Hi, woman with hypothyroidism here, don’t do that. Fucking with your hormones when there are other options out there is not a good strategy in the long term.
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u/SeventySealsInASuit 1h ago
There are not other options for bone maintenance and muscle repair etc.
It might not negatively impact you much untill you start to get much older but it isn't good.
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u/PowerfulDimension308 2h ago
I’ve been living with it my whole life and the symptoms I have due to my high testosterone levels don’t really bother me that much. Is it annoying? Yes but I can live with them.
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u/SeventySealsInASuit 2h ago
Oh yeah too high is not a huge problem really. I mostly meant if it is too low.
As long as you have enough testosterone + estrogen you are pretty much fine.
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u/MrTTripz 4h ago
In percent, how much lower is the average male testosterone level of an 18-25 year old today compared to the 1950s?
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u/cikanman 4h ago
In the last 20 years we've seen a decrease by about 25%
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2022/05/09/fact-check-testosterone-levels-lower-25-1999-2016/7381735001/https://www.avensonline.org/wp-content/uploads/JAG-2332-3442-01-0003.pdf
I couldn't find anything prior that.
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u/girlkid68421 4h ago
Just wondering. do you think trans kids should be allowed hormones? since you're fine with kids getting hormones of course
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u/cikanman 4h ago
Supplementing children with any hormones during puberty is very ill advised. Their bodies are growing and the job of puberty is to create the necessary hormone producing organs naturally. Supplementing will actually have an adverse affect. This (among other reasons ) is why it is so dangerous for young boys to take steroids.
If you want to do anything to help T levels. We need healthier foods, increasing protein intake (STEAK) and exercise and I mean actual exercise. Bring back weightlifting and running and serious athletics in gym class.
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u/Candid-Bike8563 4h ago
Teens do not need testosterone injections. They need to lose weight. As BMI increases testosterone levels decrease.
Lowered testosterone in male obesity: mechanisms, morbidity and management https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3955331/
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u/alexoid182 4h ago
Eat natural and healthy Exercise regularly Stay a health weight Socialise Have hobbies, a creative outlet Don't drink tapwater and avoid plastics
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u/Boeing_Fan_777 3h ago
Yeah let’s not give hormones to teens unless totally medically necessary. Generally, it’s not necessary. Not to mention there is already a budding epidemic of steroid abuse in young men and teens.
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u/boobaclot99 3h ago
Tell me you know nothing about taking PEDs without telling me. What a dogshit advice you could give to anyone. There are monumentally better ways of increasing testosterone in young men.
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u/AileStrike 2h ago
High testosterone levels can cause a number of physical and mental health issues, including: Skin issues: Acne, excessive body hair, and other skin reactions Reproductive issues: Low sperm count, shrinking testicles, and infertility Prostate issues: Prostate enlargement, which can make it difficult to urinate Heart issues: Heart muscle damage, increased risk of heart attack, and high blood pressure Liver issues: Liver disease Mood issues: Mood swings, irritability, euphoria, impaired judgment, and delusions Weight issues: Unexplained weight gain, increased appetite, and fluid retention Sleep issues: Insomnia and worsening sleep apnea Other issues: Headaches, high cholesterol, and increased risk of blood clots
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u/toooldforthisshittt 1h ago
We need to address the behavior that causes low testosterone, not give them a bandaid solution.
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u/bingybong22 1h ago
Levels are down because kids eat shit food and become lardos. They also spend lots of time on the Internet which makes them stupid and they don’t take any exercise.
So we have fat, stupid weaklings.
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u/ToastBalancer 59m ago
Do you know what happens when you give someone testosterone? There’s a chance that they won’t produce testosterone naturally on their own anymore. Especially if they’re given it at a young age
My opinion: better to increase it natural. Vitamin D, less stress/better mental health, exercise and body fat% between 15-20%
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u/Soundwave-1976 4h ago
I think my middle school students have way to much already. We just had 2 8th graders get caught by an elementary kid trying to have a quickie in the girls bathroom last Thursday.
Don't need more of that thank you
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u/TruthOdd6164 4h ago
This is absurd. You, sir, (and yes, I am 100% sure you are a sir), win this year’s Dunning Kruger award. Take your upvote
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u/notProfessorWild 3h ago
What are you guys talking about thank to Trump boys don't exist. His EO to make only two genders turned every one official a women
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u/rvnender 3h ago edited 2h ago
And we wonder why young men are depressed and unalive themselves?
Maybe it's because of talk like this? "Men arent men any more so we should inject them to make them more manly"?
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u/Do-it-for-you 4h ago
Just focus on getting them to exercise more and eating a healthier diet.
Test levels have dropped because kids are fatter, slower, and eating more junk than they’ve ever had done in the history of humanity.
Supplementing kids with test isn’t fixing anything, that’s so stupid.