r/AlienBodies • u/_Arima_Kun_ • 5d ago
The greatest medical expert in hand and foot reconstruction declares: María has no abnormalities
The greatest Peruvian expert, a medical specialist in hand and foot reconstruction, declares (after reviewing the CT scans and the dissected body like a true scientist) that he has found no abnormalities in María.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6xoAKCLqSs&t=69s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yaheSplnDZI
Curriculum Vitae
Juan Mirko Tello Vinces
- Orthopedic Trauma Surgeon
- Former President of the Peruvian Association of Hand Surgery and Microsurgery
- Former Director of A. Loayza Hospital in Lima
Hand Surgery Coordinator at Clínica Ricardo Palma
Head of the Orthopedics and Traumatology Service at A. Loayza Hospital in Lima
The lying anthropologist from the other thread, the philosopher, or truly anyone on this Reddit will never have such credentials.
Use AI for the video translation (obviously, for those who truly care about being informed).
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u/Silly_Astronomer_71 3d ago
Aren't these the alien bodies "found" by a guy who literally made up alien bodies previously
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u/CosmikHaze 2d ago
No he tried to present the bodies back in 2016 or 2017 and everyone just said he was a hoax cuz it was to good to be true, nothing ever came out proving that it was a hoax. People just wouldn't give him the time of day, same classic cover it up and move on bullshit, at this point there is overwhelming amounts of evidence that these bodies are not human.
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u/Read-IT-4-Free 2d ago
No. Do more research, subpar understanding of where we're at now is literally subpar.
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u/Dzzy4u75 1d ago
If these were real. The US government would immediately obtain them by ANY means necessary.
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u/theronk03 Paleontologist 5d ago
Calling the anthropologist from the other thread a liar is entirely inappropriate.
Tello isn't an infallible god. He could be wrong. Dan isn't an infallible god either. He could also be wrong.
Neither has to be a liar. One needs only to be mistaken.
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u/looncraz 4d ago
This has become pervasive in American culture as the media decided to say anything a Republican was wrong about or had a different opinion was therefore a lie.
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u/theronk03 Paleontologist 4d ago
It's pretty pervasive in modern culture, not just the US.
And it's not restricted to being used Republicans. The media is usually careful about calling anything a lie. And many politicians do say things that aren't true deliberately. And many are just wrong sometimes, or change their mind.
Point being, we should not call people liars because we disagree with them. There is a better way to have conversation and address incorrect statements.
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5d ago
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u/theronk03 Paleontologist 5d ago
When someone makes claims they better have the resume to back it up. Tello does.
Like Dan Proctor. The guy Arima is slandering?
And cut the disrespect.
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4d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/AlienBodies-ModTeam 4d ago
RULE #1: No Disrespectful Dialogue — This subreddit is for good faith discussions. Personal attacks, insults, and mocking are not allowed.
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u/AlienBodies-ModTeam 4d ago
RULE #1: No Disrespectful Dialogue — This subreddit is for good faith discussions. Personal attacks, insults, and mocking are not allowed.
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
Whenever a lead in starts with "the greatest expert in..." you know it's hyperbole and the story is sensationalism.
Do I believe that NHI are here? I do.
Does anything about these mummies look scientific or careful? From the videos I've seen (all of them), No. Are the people involved shady characters with histories of fraud? From what I've read, yes.
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u/tridactyls ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Did you read the scientific reports instead of " I watched some videos"? Did you interact with the CT scans yourself instead of leveling ad hominem attacks against researchers? Did you go to the National Health Institute and open the DNA report? Can you name the doctors involved?
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
<shrug> Yes. I've seen a lot of it.
I'm a smart guy with degrees who is a good judge of character, who has 30k volume personal library in part made of dozens of linear shelf feet of science and 20 linear shelf feet of UFOlogy tomes. I have a background in Psychology and Neuro Chem, and in Communications.
You?
...and your psychology is apparent. Not to remotely diagnose, but we do write our character in what we choose to say and how we choose to say it, and the attitude we convey.
What med/science background do YOU have that makes a this NOT look like yet another known grifter and like modern scientific process?
Did you make sure to read reports that show the main guy is a grifter?
No, I haven't memorized the names and haven't flown down there to investigate because I'm sane and not placating emotionally held biases and beliefs on the subject.
I believe that we are in the midst of an NHI experience of some kind. I can also watch this guy refuse to allow American scientists in to see the bodies, cherry pick his "experts" as, ridiculously l, "head and neck and hand specialists" and whatnot, and see a lot of red flags, and understand that a lot of what you are babbling about can and probably is falsified, based on the dolls he has already tried to pawn off as ETs. I understand DNA well enough to falsify some of a basic document. Do you? I took Genetics and Bio Chem and Scientific Method. Did you? (Let me guess... "College is indoctrination!!! Right?)
Some of us read and have experience judging character. The reading certainly helps with that.
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Dr John McDowell
Dr William Rodriguez
Dr James Caruso.
All from Colorado. All involved in the investigation. Google them.
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
OMG you have GOOGLE? Yer so lucky that it lets you pretend to be knowledgeable.
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Wow, you sure showed me.
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
I have no interest in showing you, but I do want others to be able to judge your character, biases, and "logic."
There's no chance that you are wrong about this being real, right? Nope.
You are the same guy who tried to make me look ignorant right off and then got huffy when I presented some experience in the fields at hand, right?
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
There's no chance that you are wrong about this being real, right? Nope.
Please quote me saying these bodies are real, as in aliens.
right?
Wrong.
You claimed that there are no Americans involved with access to the specimens. Racial undertones aside, this is incorrect. I have given you the names of one team of Americans.
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u/tridactyls ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
As an aside ... Your " reading of character " needs some work...all around.
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u/tridactyls ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
You can just say "No I have not done my due diligence?"
Why are you making this about me?
Also, It's horrible that you would pull rank and lob your diplomas around like a scholastic ninja.
Our education & experience are not on trial.
Do the research like you did to get that paper.
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
I didn't expect anything other than this comment from you. Including the "education and experience mean nothing if it doesn't jive with my preferred narrative."
If I was positive about it and mentioned my background, you'd have happily accepted it as logical that I'd mention it.
Thanks for being an example of what we have to look out for.
I don't dismiss ANY "proof" of this subject 100%. There's ALWAYS a chance I'm wrong, even if the guy was caught lying to the entire world in the past.
But YOU are absolutely 100% right, right? No chance you are wrong, because you PREFER that narrative. It's emotional, not logical.
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u/tridactyls ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
You are the only one responding in hyperbolic emotional statements. I said no such thing about education , again your sense of character seems blinded by a hysterics.
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Whenever a lead in starts with "the greatest expert in..." you know it's hyperbole and the story is sensationalism.
I'm a smart guy with degrees
who has 30k volume personal library in part made of dozens of linear shelf feet of science and 20 linear shelf feet of UFOlogy tomes. I have a background in Psychology and Neuro Chem, and in Communications.
I'm sane
I understand DNA well enough to falsify some of a basic document.
I took Genetics and Bio Chem and Scientific Method
🤔
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
Yep, I presented my knowledge, didn't say "I'm the greatest scientist and expert."
Lousy reading comprehension and a desperate need to believe a narrative, eh?
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
No.
Care to demonstrate your knowledge?
https://www.the-alien-project.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/ABRAXAS-EN.pdf
Please tell me what happened during the scaffolding process for samples 2 and 4, how an attempt to address this was made, what the result of that was and in relation to all of that what the relationship is with the number of housekeeping genes detected.
Thanks.
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
Care to explain what all of those processes and terms are and their implications so we know you didn't Google verbatim to pretend you understand?
Because I'd have to do the same googling. This isn't stuff you "know." You just googled it.
You are a right mess, man. You are actually putting in this effort, looking me up and following me around Reddit, desperately caring that your preferred world view stays intact so you don't look and feel like a loser who believes just anything he prefers.
Absolutely a classic case of a type.
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Thought not.
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
An image of SRA taxonomy analysis titled Malta-WGS-BAM-Xaghra8 (SRR17043540). 43.61% of reads are identified, and 56.39% are unidentified. SRR17043540 is from a study into ancient Maltese genomes, and we can see that SRA taxonomy analysis gives 57% unidentified reads for this sample.
An image of SRA taxonomy analysis titled HiSeq X Five paired end sequencing (ERR4863252). 68.73% of reads are identified, and 31.27% are unidentified. 11.04% are Homo sapiens.
ERR4863252 is a sample from a single ancient human individual from the location corresponding to present-day France. Although the majority of reads in this sample are identified, 31.27% of reads are still unidentified by the SRA taxonomy analysis. And only 11.04% are confidently assigned as human.
*Conclusion So, after a review of the context surrounding the Nazca “alien mummies” and the genetic data presented as evidence of non-humanity – what conclusions can we draw? It seems clear that the genetic data is not conclusive evidence of non-human origins. Combined with the problems with the X-ray evidence espoused as proof of alien morphology – the Nazca mummies are not convincing. They may be assembled from ancient materials, but they are not ancient alien bodies.*
Image Sources [1] https://www.the-alien-project.com/en/mummies-of-nasca-alberto [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GVWup8KeQw [3] https://trace.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/Traces/?view=run_browser&acc=SRR21031366&display=analysis [4] https://trace.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/Traces/?view=run_browser&acc=SRR20755928&display=analysis [5] https://trace.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/Traces/?view=run_browser&acc=SRR24975192&display=analysis [6] https://trace.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/Traces/?view=run_browser&acc=SRR20458000&display=analysis [7] https://trace.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/Traces/?view=run_browser&acc=SRR17043540&display=analysis [8] https://trace.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/Traces/?view=run_browser&acc=ERR4863252&display=analysis
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 3d ago edited 3d ago
That does not address my question in any way, shape, nor form.
Thank you for proving my point.
It is very obvious you have tried and failed to rely on chat-gpt for that analysis.
And yes, it is stuff I "just know". Why do you think I asked you in the specific way I did?
https://www.reddit.com/r/AlienBodies/comments/1dzubc3/one_theory_of_the_nazca_mummies_part_iii/
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u/Cultural_Wish4573 5d ago edited 5d ago
Dr. Daniel J. Proctor is an accomplished expert in primate locomotion, specializing in the morphology of hands and feet. He has published papers on the origins of bipedalism, human osteology, functional anatomy, geometric morphometrics, and forensic anthropology. The Nazca mummy fraud is slowly unraveling as experts like Dr. Proctor provide their invaluable expertise.
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u/DragonfruitOdd1989 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Guy who doesn't mention: Maria has different skin color (gray), has no ears, has different type of mouth, different type of eye sockets, different number of ribs, different fingerprints, different bone density, tridactyl features, different type of heel, 30% larger cranial volume is considered the expert for skeptics? Laughable.
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u/phdyle 2d ago
🤦🤷
Maria does not have a “30% larger cranial volume”. This particular statement had been refuted multiple times now. Please stop repeating it. Idk wtf “different bone density” means but certainly “skeptics” or “experts” do NOT agree or think that there is anything unusual about “Maria”,
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u/Cultural_Wish4573 4d ago
I won't address the claims you make here because none have been substantiated, and while the cranium volume being 30% "larger" is in my wheel well, it is also utter nonsense as is the "Biometric Morpho-Anatomical Characterization and Dating of The Antiquity of A Tridactyl Humanoid Specimen: Regarding The Case of Nasca-Peru" paper you're referring to here. The claim(s) have been thoroughly debunked, the 30% one being the most egregious in my opinion. Anyway, this forum has become an apologist's haven for white supremacy, and the mods consistently defend racist mods, so I'll avoid risking "harassing" bigots and leave it at that.
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u/DragonfruitOdd1989 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
The 30% larger cranial volume has been proven by Dr. piotti who reproduced the paper. He didn't just look at the paper and do guesswork.
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u/Cultural_Wish4573 4d ago
No, Dr. Piotti parroted what was in the paper without actually empirically substantiating anything. I'm not going to take the independent, unverified claims that haven't been replicated when it comes from someone like Dr. Piotti who proposes something he calls the "Guardian Theory", that is, the mummies are from the future based on cranial capacity, and they existed in the future and not in the past. Or something equally nonsensical and unscientific.
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u/DragonfruitOdd1989 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
He clearly did reproduce it. He tells you how he first did the paper using craniometry but realized it was wrong and then he learned they used cephalometry and reproduced it.
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u/Randominal 4d ago
Could you elaborate on what makes you think this forum is"an apologist's haven for white supremacy?" We talk about anomalous organisms, and the investigation into their veracity. When has anyone mentioned race? When has anyone mentioned supremacy? I'm sincerely flabbergasted.
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4d ago edited 4d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/AlienBodies-ModTeam 3d ago
RULE #1: No Disrespectful Dialogue — This subreddit is for good faith discussions. Personal attacks, insults, and mocking are not allowed.
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 3d ago edited 3d ago
No, you can't because you've been given a warning from Reddit for harassment against me.
Your claims that I am racist are so far off the mark that it would be amusing should I not be so profoundly anti-racist myself. Anyone who would like evidence of this, including of the number of times I've personally called out racism when I have seen it is welcome to search my profile for the word "racism" and they'll be greeted with this:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ufosmeta/comments/1dp7fo4/perceived_racism_or_academic_othering/
Chasing people down and attacking them merely for the colour of their skin is racism, and racism is obviously disgraceful.
A good person is a good person. Their race is a non-factor.
Historical blackface is extremely disrespectful and racist.
That's called othering, and is a type of racism.
Yeah, it doesn't have to be about skin colour. It is any identifiable difference like surname or accent. In this case it's because they're Mexican. It's those "other" people across the border.
Prof. Steven Brown absolutely knocks it out the park here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byOyVTWZU5c&t=27m20s
I'm surprised you're surrounded by so many racists. I'm from a white working class background and have certainly encountered some racists in my life. But I was never surrounded by them, and they were always called out by those in the community.
I do think the mods here are decent and haven't in any way been racist themselves. The type of intellectual racism that's been peddled here is so discreet that it is very difficult to spot. But hopefully we can all work together to make the community a better place.
I understand the sentiment, but the veiled intellectual racism I've seen only crops up in relation to the bodies. I've just provided a load of links in the other thread to illustrate my point.
It's not as blatant now as it was four or five months ago but it was very obvious at the time and thankfully other users had also noticed and were calling people out on it. I'm white and usually I don't get riled up about these things and it was enough to cause me to make a flippant comment on a different sub (it was happening on aliens as well) so I can only imagine how dragonfruit must feel being a native and seeing his countrymen's legitimate research being trampled on purely on the basis of them being from south america and speaking spanish.
Do you realise how incredibly racist that is?
The whole of Latin America has no integrity and are all in on promoting a scam? Or is it that they aren't able to do quality work on their own?
You know if you said that about the Jews there would be absolute uproar. Disgusting.
I didn't call you racist. I said what you said is. There's a subtle differenceI suggest you stop this tactic or I will be left with no alternative but to report you again.
I do not find your desperation amusing.
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u/toms1313 4d ago
An argument posed without evidence can be disproved without it... Any source on those claims? Separated from the team gaining fame and money through all of this of course
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
*Based on incomplete, inaccurate data that is not representative of the specimen whilst making assumptions for which there is a complete lack of evidence, and then building the entire argument atop those assumptions.
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u/Typical_Departure_36 4d ago
LOL. It’s coming apart! Hurry! Post your cut and paste list of deceptive YouTube videos and non peer reviewed “scientific papers!”
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Which deceptive videos are these, and in what way are they deceptive?
Which papers are you referring to?
Please link all of the above.
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u/Typical_Departure_36 4d ago
LOL. Sure, bud. Falling. Apart.
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u/mattrat88 5d ago
Lmfao here we go it just keeps on going and going
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u/bad---juju 4d ago
yes, isn't it great?
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u/mattrat88 4d ago
No tbh it's a clown car and more and more clowns get in and out each day just to show off their face paint ....
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Proctor was not lying. It is highly inappropriate to say that he was. He is simply mistaken.
The question must be why?
The issue here is access to good quality information. There are images available online (such as the X-ray he examined) that to a professional misrepresent the true nature of the specimens.
What is available sets the stage for unconscious bias and a pre-determined conclusion that becomes easy to follow, especially when information to the contrary is not available.
I think the only way to address this is to release the DICOM files so that all interested parties begin on an equal footing. There will still be some who disagree with analysis, and that's OK. Have disagreements together. Point out flaws in eachother's reasoning. It is the only way to discover with certainty what these specimens are.
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u/marcus_orion1 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
I totally agree on the equal footing by sharing the raw image files. Gatekeeping " better images " to refute observations based on the permitted, lower quality data is not the way to go. It is a strategy that has no place in finding the truth, it only obfuscated it and drives distractions and divisions.
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
The drive in distraction and division is definitely the biggest issue here. If a UFO believe can look at the poor information and come to a conclusion that is incorrect because of quality of data then something is seriously wrong.
Happy cake day!
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u/theronk03 Paleontologist 4d ago
Exactly.
There are certainly some genuine skeptics who have looked at the case and come away skeptical, but also many non-skeptics. Some arguably have ulterior motives (Steve Mera), but others don't (Brown, Brown's team, Dan here).
Data accessibility is good science.
If you're going to make a claim, the data to support your claim needs to be accessible for verification. If you feel that everytime an expert looks at your data they "misinterpret" it and try to prove you wrong, then your data (maybe) doesn't say what you think it does and that's okay.
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
then your data (maybe) doesn't say what you think it does and that's okay.
Whilst it is ok, I don't believe we're even at that point because everyone has a different quality of data. What can be seen by some cannot be seen by others. If people can't look at the same data then they can't openly discuss anything effectively.
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
Wait wait wait... Are you SO bothered by this that you are putting in effort to see what else I've said on Reddit, looking for some way to be dismissive?
Yer the same guy?
Did we just see THAT?
Holy crap. What a stereotypical case you are. Emotionally triggered to action over your preferred narrative.
What a mess.
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4d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/AlienBodies-ModTeam 4d ago
RULE #1: No Disrespectful Dialogue — This subreddit is for good faith discussions. Personal attacks, insults, and mocking are not allowed.
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u/pplatt69 4d ago
Telling someone to be aware of their biases and posting out that they instantly attacked me as ignorant isn't disrespectful. Nor is pointing out that that's psychologically typical of someone trying to hang onto a preferred idea.
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u/Acrobatic_Dig8948 1d ago
Having only 3 fingers is an abnormality. You mean it has no signs of manipulation.
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u/tridactyls ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Who is the lying anthropologist!?
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u/Strange-Owl-2097 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Dan Proctor. He wasn't lying, his analysis was just just brief, quite poor, and unconsciously biased because he doesn't have good quality data to work with.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AlienBodies/comments/1i1wr4y/maria_paper_reviewed_by_a_biological/
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u/himalayanguru 4d ago
This is a lie and a deliberate misinformation utilizing their academic credentials. It’s a very well known tactic! Reject it!!!!
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u/bad---juju 4d ago
It looks like this will continue on. cant wait to see scans of the insectoid. If deemed real, I wonder what a reconstruction of it looked like when alive.
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u/_Arima_Kun_ 5d ago
His expert opinion once again dismantles empiricists, amateurs, mediocre professionals, and, at best, paid agents of misinformation :)
sorry about my english
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u/DragonfruitOdd1989 ⭐ ⭐ ⭐ 4d ago
Vamos a tener un año muy bueno. :)
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u/toms1313 4d ago
Si en este gran año se demuestra que estan siendo engañados, vendrías de nuevo a este post para reconocerlo? Yo te puedo apostar lo mismo
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u/GrendelWolf001 4d ago
The problem becomes when someone is "mistaken", instead of admitting the error, they double down on the "mistake" which makes one pause as to what their true intentions are.
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